Harsh shifting and shift flaring (dealer wants to replace valve body) 2016 Escalade 113k miles

[DurtyKurty]

New to me 2016 Escalade with 113k miles. Had a little bit of a harsh 1-2 shift. I noticed the trans temp acting goofy so after doing some research I got the dealer to replace the trans temp wiring harness, filter, and fluid yesterday under special warranty. They did a fast learn on it after and told me it's still shifting bad. They told me that they wanted to replace the valve body for $1900 which was a shock to me. I'm not one to throw parts at something so I'm not sure how they arrived there so I took it home and here I sit trying to figure out what to do. On my ride home I found that it is shifting worse than it did before I brought it in. Its flaring on 2 or 3 gears now and occasionally hard shifting and a couple times delayed engagement.

I did some quick research and found valve body's online with the same part number that the parts department gave me. I understand they have to make money, but they had quoted just over $1400 for the valve body and the two seals that they need. They are $700 on Summits website. If I'm going to throw parts at something I sure don't want those parts marked up 100% plus pay their expensive 3.5 hours of labor at their shop rate.

My VIN is 1GYS4BKJ1GR331622 The part number they provided in parts dept was 24042435. On GMpartsstore it says 24042435 was replaced with 19432719 which is just over $600 online. Anyone know for sure based off my VIN what all I would need to provide to another shop to just install these new OEM parts and how much I would expect to pay for labor to do so.

Thanks!

Kurt

 

[B-train]

Is it the 6 or 8 speed? If 8 speed, did they actually get the level correct when the serviced it? Just went through this shitshow on my 2017. It wasn't flaring up, but had a cavitation noise.

If 6 speed, you may be in deeper based on what has been stated on this site numerous times. Maybe @NickTransmissions would have better insight.

 

[swathdiver]

Valve body by itself doesn't sound right.

 

[DurtyKurty]

Is it the 6 or 8 speed? If 8 speed, did they actually get the level correct when the serviced it? Just went through this shitshow on my 2017. It wasn't flaring up, but had a cavitation noise.

If 6 speed, you may be in deeper based on what has been stated on this site numerous times. Maybe @NickTransmissions would have better insight.

8sp

 

[DurtyKurty]

Is it the 6 or 8 speed? If 8 speed, did they actually get the level correct when the serviced it? Just went through this shitshow on my 2017. It wasn't flaring up, but had a cavitation noise.

If 6 speed, you may be in deeper based on what has been stated on this site numerous times. Maybe @NickTransmissions would have better insight.

And yes he told me he set level with trans at right temp with the set bolt

 

[NickTransmissions]

New to me 2016 Escalade with 113k miles. Had a little bit of a harsh 1-2 shift. I noticed the trans temp acting goofy so after doing some research I got the dealer to replace the trans temp wiring harness, filter, and fluid yesterday under special warranty. They did a fast learn on it after and told me it's still shifting bad. They told me that they wanted to replace the valve body for $1900 which was a shock to me. I'm not one to throw parts at something so I'm not sure how they arrived there so I took it home and here I sit trying to figure out what to do. On my ride home I found that it is shifting worse than it did before I brought it in. Its flaring on 2 or 3 gears now and occasionally hard shifting and a couple times delayed engagement.

I did some quick research and found valve body's online with the same part number that the parts department gave me. I understand they have to make money, but they had quoted just over $1400 for the valve body and the two seals that they need. They are $700 on Summits website. If I'm going to throw parts at something I sure don't want those parts marked up 100% plus pay their expensive 3.5 hours of labor at their shop rate.

My VIN is 1GYS4BKJ1GR331622 The part number they provided in parts dept was 24042435. On GMpartsstore it says 24042435 was replaced with 19432719 which is just over $600 online. Anyone know for sure based off my VIN what all I would need to provide to another shop to just install these new OEM parts and how much I would expect to pay for labor to do so.

Thanks!

Kurt

Ill read this more thorougly s bit later and provide a more detailed response then but generally speaking, delayed engagements and flares are either VB or case.

When (what gears) are you experiencing flares and delayed engagements? Any missing gears?

A priori, it prob needs to come out for overhaul but ill review it later before i say for sure based in info you have/can provide.

 

[NickTransmissions]

@DurtyKurty - Do you know what fluid was put into the trans at the time of service?

I am not yet familiar with the 8 and 10 speed GM units however your symptoms can be sticking valves in the valve body or initial failure symptoms of applied elements in the case...Flaring and delayed engagement occurs when one set of applied elements are coming off and another set are 'coming on' to enable the mechanical shift to the next gear in the sequence. So if applied elements (clutch packs, bands) are excessively worn, they will neutralize until max line pressure for that element is present for like a split second or so. Once they completely wear, flare shifts will be replaced by a neutral condition for that gear.

In essense, it's a timing issue which is either caused by:

1) Delays in the application of the next set of applied elements required to grab the next gear due to valve(s) in the valve body not stroking due to either being stuck or mechanical functional issues w/the applicable solenoids that control those valves
2) Incorrect clearances in one or more applied elements (bands, clutch packs)
3) Worn checkballs/cbs stuck in the spscer plate or displaced from their locations

Harsh shifting (especially if it's late) is either broken accumulator springs (for those transmissions that have accumulator circuite), malfunctioning pressure switches (like those on a 6L trans TEHCM) or worn valve train components.


Next steps: I would stick a two - way scanner on a drive around to see if
a) shifts are being commanded by the PCM
b) and if so, if they are occurring as expected or not

If the ECM is functioning correctly (i.e. shifts are being commanded as expected) then the problem is likely in either the VB, solenoids or both.

At that point, time to drop the valve body, test solenoids for electrical and mechanical function and valve trains for freedom of movement and check balls.

 

[DurtyKurty]

@DurtyKurty - Do you know what fluid was put into the trans at the time of service?

I am not yet familiar with the 8 and 10 speed GM units however your symptoms can be sticking valves in the valve body or initial failure symptoms of applied elements in the case...Flaring and delayed engagement occurs when one set of applied elements are coming off and another set are 'coming on' to enable the mechanical shift to the next gear in the sequence. So if applied elements (clutch packs, bands) are excessively worn, they will neutralize until max line pressure for that element is present for like a split second or so. Once they completely wear, flare shifts will be replaced by a neutral condition for that gear.

In essense, it's a timing issue which is either caused by:

1) Delays in the application of the next set of applied elements required to grab the next gear due to valve(s) in the valve body not stroking due to either being stuck or mechanical functional issues w/the applicable solenoids that control those valves
2) Incorrect clearances in one or more applied elements (bands, clutch packs)
3) Worn checkballs/cbs stuck in the spscer plate or displaced from their locations

Harsh shifting (especially if it's late) is either broken accumulator springs (for those transmissions that have accumulator circuite), malfunctioning pressure switches (like those on a 6L trans TEHCM) or worn valve train components.


Next steps: I would stick a two - way scanner on a drive around to see if
a) shifts are being commanded by the PCM
b) and if so, if they are occurring as expected or not

If the ECM is functioning correctly (i.e. shifts are being commanded as expected) then the problem is likely in either the VB, solenoids or both.

At that point, time to drop the valve body, test solenoids for electrical and mechanical function and valve trains for freedom of movement and check balls.

Mobil 1 LV ATF HP fluid

 

[NickTransmissions]

Mobil 1 LV ATF HP fluid

Did any of the above info help?

Also, did the dealer do a diag (scanning, two-way testing, visually inspecting) the valve body and solenoids before informing that you need a new one?

 

[DurtyKurty]

Did any of the above info help?

Also, did the dealer do a diag (scanning, two-way testing, visually inspecting) the valve body and solenoids before informing that you need a new one?

Thanks for the info. They scanned after the temp sensor replacement and did the quick learn. I don’t think they suspected the VB going into this as it’s normally that temp sensor causing the issues. They just dropped pan replaced sensor, fluid, and filter and put her back together for a test drive after fluid level check. I guess the solenoids are built into the VB which is what they told me.

 

[NickTransmissions]

Thanks for the info. They scanned after the temp sensor replacement and did the quick learn. I don’t think they suspected the VB going into this as it’s normally that temp sensor causing the issues. They just dropped pan replaced sensor, fluid, and filter and put her back together for a test drive after fluid level check. I guess the solenoids are built into the VB which is what they told me.

Transgo makes a kit to correct flares, delayed engagements & harsh shifts associated with the pulse dampner malfunctioning for those 8-speed units. That may be at the root of your issue.

If you do plan on installing a valve body kit of any kind, you'll need to perform a "fast adapt relearn" to reset the transmission command and control logic to factory defaults.

I wouldnt drive it any more until you can get it fixed as repeated flares and harsh engagements can potentially damage hard parts inside the trans...

 

[DurtyKurty]

Someone in the Cadillac forums mentioned a buzzing sound could be heard after engine is shut off if the valve body (I'm guess solenoid is defective).

So I pulled it into the garage this morning as I was going to do plugs/wires and filters this afternoon and there was a definite buzzing/fast ticking sound coming from the trans pan after I shut it off that lasted probably 30 seconds or longer

 

[NickTransmissions]

Drop the pan and ohm out the solenoids using a DVOM.

Look up the resistance to confirm but if they're like any of the other other force solenoids used in all GM transmissions, normal resistance is prob somewhere between 20-23 ohms.

If one or more is way off from the others, you've found the problem(s).

Like i said, i'd not drive it until you have a chance to get it fixed but your call...

 

[PA-WOODCHUCK]

choices:
1- trust the dealer
2- 2nd opinion at another dealer
3- another opinion at "trans" shop
4- live with it

I like watching this guy especially on TikTok

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCTqPiwyy6v8WWb9YAIcLfDQ

Brandon Sloan (@performancetransmission) | TikTok

Brandon Sloan (@performancetransmission) on TikTok | 8.2M Likes. 983.2K Followers. ⬇️Everything Is In The Link⬇️ Email for collabs down below.Watch the latest video from Brandon Sloan (@performancetransmission).

www.tiktok.com

 

[NickTransmissions]

choices:
1- trust the dealer
2- 2nd opinion at another dealer
3- another opinion at "trans" shop
4- live with it

I like watching this guy especially on TikTok

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCTqPiwyy6v8WWb9YAIcLfDQ

Brandon Sloan (@performancetransmission) | TikTok

Brandon Sloan (@performancetransmission) on TikTok | 8.2M Likes. 983.2K Followers. ⬇️Everything Is In The Link⬇️ Email for collabs down below.Watch the latest video from Brandon Sloan (@performancetransmission).

www.tiktok.com

5 - diag and fix it so that you

- dont have to "live with it" at least until internal case damage occurs and its not drivable

- unnecessarily spend money at one or more dealerships or transmission shops

@DurtyKurty - Here' a tear down video where the guy shows/explains how to remove the 8L's valve body (if you detetermine the vb or solenoid(s) are the source of the problem).

 

[DurtyKurty]

Drop the pan and ohm out the solenoids using a DVOM.

Look up the resistance to confirm but if they're like any of the other other force solenoids used in all GM transmissions, normal resistance is prob somewhere between 20-23 ohms.

If one or more is way off from the others, you've found the problem(s).

Like i said, i'd not drive it until you have a chance to get it fixed but your call...

I didnt have an option...this is my daily driver.

 

[DurtyKurty]

over the last few days...after the fast relearn and i took posession and put on a couple hundred miles...I've experienced 1 to none delayed engagements... 80% of the time shift flares 1-2 shifts...sometimes it shifts normal but not normally and occasionally a 4-5 (i think the gear) shift flare...the tq converterter lockup confuses me on which gear were talking about

 

[NickTransmissions]

I didnt have an option...this is my daily driver.

Yep, i know its a tough situation, try to consolidate trips. Hopefully your drivability symptoms dont worsen before you can fix it (or get it fixed).

If you can do the work yourself, you'd save a boatload of $$. If you dont have the scanner needed to do a fast adapt, a mobile mechanic can prob do it for $150-200 or so...

 

[DurtyKurty]

Yep, i know its a tough situation, try to consolidate trips. Hopefully your drivability symptoms dont worsen before you can fix it (or get it fixed).

If you can do the work yourself, you'd save a boatload of $$. If you dont have the scanner needed to do a fast adapt, a mobile mechanic can prob do it for $150-200 or so...

its all gotten better except the 1-2 shift flare and the occasionaly 3-4 or 4-5 flare (i think its the 4-5 flare). Wish i had more space. I used to tune LS stuff and have done a lot of work 15 years ago on my stuff but not now.

 

[Gearz]

I never had any luck with having any transmissions worked on or overhauled. I spent to much money and they fixed one thing and another thing went bad. I personally learnt my leson a put GM reman in that had a warranty and all the updates done. You can go poor fixing it. When I put the reman in the truck came back to life and the initial problem was the torque converter which they miss diagnosed and replaced a valve body .Just my 2 cents.