Truth or Lie

[ivin74]

Grand wagoneer ugly as hell

I agree, I don't think they are selling that well either. I've seen lots of inventory on jeep dealerships.

 

[wsteele]

On the specific question of how likely it is the dealer (any dealer) is lying to you, in my experience you have an 80% chance they are.

Usually when my weather app says 80%, it rains/snows.

PS-That probability pertains to the sales side. I have had much better luck on the service side, but not 100%…

 

[Polo08816]

Well… It would have to be another vehicle that could accommodate very comfortably a family of six and could tow a trailer. So I guess that would put me in a Tahoe high country. But for the price I would rather have the Yukon.
I sure wouldn’t do a minivan let me tell you that. My husband already has a truck so we don’t have a need for another one and this would be my daily driver.

The updated 2022 Ford Expedition is about to hit production. Would you consider that an alternative?

Dealerships are LOVING some of you right now.... Impatience and not willing to wait are also what is driving the costs up so much. When you have all of these orders stacking up at dealerships, they are licking their chops and KNOW they can get away with charging 10-20k over MSRP. Having a new Denali is not a life or death situation here, and that is how some of you are making your purchases out to be. Why not just wait until the dust settles on the chip shortages and manufacturing goes back to normal? Then you can buy exactly what you want, instead of a 'Frankenstein' package.

What do you all think of the new Grand Wagoneer? The jury is still out for me on those, haha

I agree, I don't think they are selling that well either. I've seen lots of inventory on jeep dealerships.

I think the problem with the Wagoneer/Grand Wagoneer is price. They need to come down another $10-15k to be competitive in terms of the overall package.

I also wouldn't trust a 1st year Jeep. I think Jeep's development lifecycle is:

1st year - prototype
2nd year - alpha testing
3rd year - beta testing
4th year - actually ready for production

GM's isn't too much better. I'd wait for a 3rd year GM. I'm okay with a 2nd year Toyota.

 

[ivin74]

Dealerships are LOVING some of you right now.... Impatience and not willing to wait are also what is driving the costs up so much. When you have all of these orders stacking up at dealerships, they are licking their chops and KNOW they can get away with charging 10-20k over MSRP. Having a new Denali is not a life or death situation here, and that is how some of you are making your purchases out to be. Why not just wait until the dust settles on the chip shortages and manufacturing goes back to normal? Then you can buy exactly what you want, instead of a 'Frankenstein' package.

What do you all think of the new Grand Wagoneer? The jury is still out for me on those, haha

I don't think the inventory is going back to normal any time soon. Please read the article on the link below, GM and Ford are using a build-shy strategy to sell for higher profits.

GM has 10,000 full-sized SUVs parked in Texas awaiting chips - Autoblog

By the most recent figures, General Motors' backlog of SUVs awaiting semiconductor chip components has reached more than 10,000 units parked in Texas.

www.autoblog.com

 

[steiny93]

My wife picked up a denali xl duramax; I did a write up about it in the duramax forum.
In summary, she loves it; for the money I'm unimpressed, the last BMW I had (X5) was head and shoulders ahead in the luxury game; to be fair one would need to compare with an X7 however.

The GMC mileage is crazy impressive, last weekend we did a ~600 mile road trip. at the pump it did 29.5mpg for the trip; for a full sized truck. Granted, it isn't a drivers vehicle, rather it's a bus.

GMC is trying to get into the lux market but they have a long way to go. Auto hvac, cabin quality and touch entry are light years behind the European offerings as 3 glaring examples. I'd put the Ford and the Toyota competitors below the GMC with the Wagoneer at a similar level when comparing these type of amenities.

 

[program4444]

My wife picked up a denali xl duramax; I did a write up about it in the duramax forum.
In summary, she loves it; for the money I'm unimpressed, the last BMW I had (X5) was head and shoulders ahead in the luxury game; to be fair one would need to compare with an X7 however.

The GMC mileage is crazy impressive, last weekend we did a ~600 mile road trip. at the pump it did 29.5mpg for the trip; for a full sized truck. Granted, it isn't a drivers vehicle, rather it's a bus.

GMC is trying to get into the lux market but they have a long way to go. Auto hvac, cabin quality and touch entry are light years behind the European offerings as 3 glaring examples. I'd put the Ford and the Toyota competitors below the GMC with the Wagoneer at a similar level when comparing these type of amenities.

Dug up an almost a year old thread for this breakdown?

 

[steiny93]

Dug up an almost a year old thread for this breakdown?

I didn't realize the thread was so old, looks like this forum is rather sparse on content.

 

[Pertzbro]

I didn't realize the thread was so old, looks like this forum is rather sparse on content.

It is. It's amazing how little content/post compared to the 5th Gen Ram forum I frequent. It's easily 80% less.

 

[marvcus]

Dealerships are LOVING some of you right now.... Impatience and not willing to wait are also what is driving the costs up so much. When you have all of these orders stacking up at dealerships, they are licking their chops and KNOW they can get away with charging 10-20k over MSRP. Having a new Denali is not a life or death situation here, and that is how some of you are making your purchases out to be. Why not just wait until the dust settles on the chip shortages and manufacturing goes back to normal?

Old post but shot right between the eyes.

I just saw that 49% of 2022 new Tahoe/Yukon owners are paying over $1,000/mo.

Sure, some took advantage of 0% interest or paid off early, but a sizable chunk of owners are forking over mortgage payments for a Denali. And that could be for 72+ months!

This is unsustainable. What I wonder is what is going to happen once inventory starts to even out and discounts/incentives come? All the folks who were patient are going to be up against these owners who want to get out of the large albatross payment and into a cheaper one on a new Tahoe at a discount.

We’ll see what happens …

 

[Polo08816]

Old post but shot right between the eyes.

I just saw that 49% of 2022 new Tahoe/Yukon owners are paying over $1,000/mo.

Sure, some took advantage of 0% interest or paid off early, but a sizable chunk of owners are forking over mortgage payments for a Denali. And that could be for 72+ months!

This is unsustainable. What I wonder is what is going to happen once inventory starts to even out and discounts/incentives come? All the folks who were patient are going to be up against these owners who want to get out of the large albatross payment and into a cheaper one on a new Tahoe at a discount.

We’ll see what happens …

I think you may be referring to this video:

What that indicates to me is that the demographic for Tahoe/Yukons are going to be interest rate sensitive. With the recent GDP numbers and no indication that inflation is slowing down, I wouldn't be surprised if the Fed continues with a 75 bps increase in December and potentially even January as well. It's going to affect demand.

I'm waiting until 2024 for a couple of reasons but most importantly, I have real concerns about build quality and reliability of vehicles that have sat on a lot for months waiting for parts.

 

[vcode]

I think you may be referring to this video:

What that indicates to me is that the demographic for Tahoe/Yukons are going to be interest rate sensitive. With the recent GDP numbers and no indication that inflation is slowing down, I wouldn't be surprised if the Fed continues with a 75 bps increase in December and potentially even January as well. It's going to affect demand.

I'm waiting until 2024 for a couple of reasons but most importantly, I have real concerns about build quality and reliability of vehicles that have sat on a lot for months waiting for parts.

There is a lot of money out there right now. All my financial friends agree. Inflation means nothing to these folks, they are flush with cash. Those who are worried about paying an extra $50/week for groceries are not buying loaded Tahoe's and Yukon's at $5-10K over MSRP. Same thing with Bronco's and EV's. Some folks are paying $200K to get a new Hummer! I don't see an end to this until we actually land in a recession.

 

[DuraYuk]

There is a lot of money out there right now. All my financial friends agree. Inflation means nothing to these folks, they are flush with cash. Those who are worried about paying an extra $50/week for groceries are not buying loaded Tahoe's and Yukon's at $5-10K over MSRP. Same thing with Bronco's and EV's. Some folks are paying $200K to get a new Hummer! I don't see an end to this until we actually land in a recession.

I agree. People buying 60k+ suvs are not worried about inflation. Now it will kill some demand as discretionary spending tightens but nothing crazy.

 

[VPVETTE]

It's sound true and false..... Each dealer is given an allocation of vehicles. Could be your dealer has your order in, but doesn't have an allotted allocation to fill the order. As for constraints, you can SOMETIMES get options wanted individually, or in packages they may be available. That was the Frankenstein term he was using.
I would ask your original dealer how many allocations they get and were you are in that line. Volume dealers will usually get more allocations, therefore they are putting in more "accepted" orders. Depending how knowledgeable your salesman is, he/she might be able to recognize how to get certain options that might be constrained one way, but not another.

Or as others have stated, they could be blowing smoke up your ***. In any case, if deposits are refundable, it never hurts to put your eggs in multiple baskets.

 

[todayusay]

Definitely people out there with some outrageous payments, but every situation is different for sure…We drive ours to the tune of 40k+ miles a year and usually try to trade before we hit 65k-ish (plus or minus 10-15k depending on how used Tahoes/Yukon’s are doing on the used market). Being able to to sell a 2021 with 45k on it for 2 grand less than what we paid and then put 15k on a 22 in 4 months and selling more than what we paid just made sense. Now have a 23 and it’ll be interesting to see how it holds its value by this time next year or spring of 24

 

[Polo08816]

There is a lot of money out there right now. All my financial friends agree. Inflation means nothing to these folks, they are flush with cash. Those who are worried about paying an extra $50/week for groceries are not buying loaded Tahoe's and Yukon's at $5-10K over MSRP. Same thing with Bronco's and EV's. Some folks are paying $200K to get a new Hummer! I don't see an end to this until we actually land in a recession.

Sure there is, but that trend is slowly reversing (at the moment):

I agree. People buying 60k+ suvs are not worried about inflation. Now it will kill some demand as discretionary spending tightens but nothing crazy.

So I think we need to be more precise because I think we're talking about a bunch of different groups of consumers:

1. Consumers that already bought SUVs - already paid cash or locked in a fixed rate auto loan almost like someone who already has a 15 or 30 year fixed rate mortgage when interest rates were low
2. Prospective cash buyers - not as affected by inflation due to nature of a cash purchase
3. Prospective buyers that require financing - interest rate sensitive
4. No longer a prospective buyer - needs have changed or prices have increased to a point where they seek alternatives

#1 - My suspicion is that a sizable % of the people on this forum are already in this group so they may not be speaking from the perspective of the other groups. For someone that's settled and not looking to purchase a home, inflation has little bearing on a fixed rate 15-30 year mortgage.

#2 - The group that can drop $50-90k in cash for a vehicle is not common. I think they would not be affected by inflation as much - but remember, about 50% of sales in this group are finance purchases and that will increase as the MSRP of these vehicles increase since wages are not keeping pace with inflation.

#3 - This group is definitely going to be affected by interest rate increases and they're going to hold back from purchasing because of economic uncertainty. If you didn't have 50+k in cash to purchase the vehicle outright, you may give pause when you're potentially on the hook for the remaining payments on this vehicle when the economy takes a shit and you're unemployed.

#4 - I think this is the most interesting group because one would initially think that this group has determined that they would not be able to or want to purchase a full size SUV at the moment. But I would argue that your #2 buyer could also be your #4 buyer. The 1/2 ton full size SUV is what I would consider one of the most in demand segments. In my case, I was originally looking at purchasing a 1/2 ton full size SUV because it could carry people (if needed) or tow a track car to and from racetracks on the East Coast. But I'm re-considering purchasing a 1/2 ton pickup in 2024 instead since that market is more of a buyer's market at the moment. I would then push off my 1/2 ton full size SUV purchase until 2026-2028 when supply recovers more - heck perhaps by then, I don't need the towing or payload capability of a 1/2 ton full size SUV and a 3 row unibody SUV like a Jeep Grand Cherokee L would suffice in addition to my pickup, track car, and commuter car.

The point is, I think people with 60+k cash to purchase these vehicles are also going to figure out how to make it work for them over a longer time horizon and adjust how they are going to life cycle their fleet to get the most bang for their buck.