[SOLVED] Need help identifying oil leak when the car is on

[rdezs]

Check your harmonic balancer for a wear groove....if it's worn, it will cause a new seal to leak.

 

[thefrey]

Check your harmonic balancer for a wear groove....if it's worn, it will cause a new seal to leak.

Perhaps a small groove. I may have needed to clean this way more before I installed it. Rookie mistake?

 

[thefrey]

You’ve received thorough and good advice. I think your course of action is pretty clear.

I agree. Thanks everybody.

Ordering an alignment tool & going from there…

 

[SpareParts]

Clean that pulley with some steel wool or 1500 grit wet dry.
What did the seal look like?

 

[thefrey]

Clean that pulley with some steel wool or 1500 grit wet dry.
What did the seal look like?

Could the pulley not being clean have caused a leak like this?

The angle makes it look off center just fair warning lol

Seal looked fine, something odd going on with the closest seal but perhaps that was from removing the harmonic balancer.

 

[solli5pack]

Thanks for the long reply.


This is where things make me scratch my head… I installed my front timing cover without the pan on so I am confused how I ended up with such a bad leak. I don’t really know how I could’ve been THAT far off from center unless I did something really wrong. I am gonna pull the harmonic balancer and try to measure how centered things are

It leaked because you didn't use the alingment tool with the oil pan simulator at the same time. That's what the flat plate in the kit is for. I've only done it once but I did it with the oil pan off and used the alingment kit. No leaks. On a side note I guess you're using an ARP bolt on the balancer?

 

[thefrey]

It leaked because you didn't use the alingment tool with the oil pan simulator at the same time. That's what the flat plate in the kit is for. I've only done it once but I did it with the oil pan off and used the alingment kit. No leaks. On a side note I guess you're using an ARP bolt on the balancer?View attachment 474474

No, I haven’t been using an ARP bolt. Any reason why you say that?

 

[alvocado]

ARP bolts are reusable.

 

[West 1]

Basic stuff: There should be no wear on the harmonic balancer because it runs on a teflon seal. Teflon is very unique. On install, Clean and Dry as others already mentioned here. The teflon will start impregnating on the crank surface. After initial break in the teflon is rubbing on teflon and you have zero wear for as much as a million miles of use. Proven in HD diesel engines for 30 years now. If grease or oil are used on install the seal will leak about 75% of the time. Some guys have done it wrong and got away with it but most find the Leak right away. The grease or oil slows or stops the teflon from sealing to the crankshaft. Clean and dry installs seal perfectly and last forever. (ok, 10 times longer than standard seals with no wear on the crank snout, old style seals could not do this)

Unique to teflon on install is the surface has to be ultra clean. I usually polish with 600 grit rotating as I clean It up so no flat spots are left on the surface. Clean it till it looks new and you can't detect any rough spots all the way to the end of the snout. Any rough spot on install will scratch the soft teflon and you will have a leak path. So, very smooth and clean, no oil, grease or lube, even make sure your hands are clean as you handle these parts on install.

On installing the timing cover plate to the engine. Use the tool if available to help center the seal to the crankshaft. I have done several without the tool and no leaks yet but I consider this being lucky so far. The tool eliminates guessing. Install all cover bolts but leave them less than hand tight. When torquing the timing cover make sure you tighten the face bolts first until they are at full torque, following a pattern so you don't distort or crack the plate and then torque the bolts from below coming up from the pan. If you torque the pan bolts first you will possibly pull the timing cover down and it might not remain centered to the crank snout. Once this is done install your fully cleaned and polished harmonic balancer and you should be leak free.

On the balancer bolt, it has a rubber seal under the bolt head and sealant on the threads. These avoid leaks. Re using even a ARP bolt still risks leaks at these two spots so you would need to use a thread sealant on the treads and maybe silicone on the under side of the bolt head rubber to make sure they both seal like a new bolt would?

When using silicone or the right stuff on the surface at the oil pan and timing cover be super stingy. All excess can squeeze out inside the engine, chunks can come loose and cause bad issues later on. Be stingy not much more than a thin film and you will be ok.
I have seen Oil pump pick up screens plugged by some ya hoo that used excess silicone, you never want to be that guy.

 

[j91z28d1]

when you put the cover on with the pan off, did you have the balancer installed before tightening the bolts?

 

[thefrey]

when you put the cover on with the pan off, did you have the balancer installed before tightening the bolts?

yep, I put the bolts on by hand for the front cover and then installed the balancer. I rotated the balancer and then snugged up all the bolts after

I learned today that 1) it doesn’t work or 2) i didn’t do it right. Cover was definitely misaligned as shown from the alignment tool. Reinstalled the cover with the alignment tool and then reinstalling the harmonic balancer tomorrow.

 

[Dustin Jackson]

@thefrey Because the front and rear covers are part of the oil pan sealing situation I was never sure which to install first. How was aligning the front cover with the oil pan in place, or did you loosen the oil pan?

 

[donjetman]

I learned today that 1) it doesn’t work or 2) i didn’t do it right.

#2 was the problem
I'll repeat for others here: "I replaced my timing cover seal, pulley/balancer, etc 5k miles and 1.5 yrs ago. I didn't use an alignment tool. I did have the oil pan off. I DID put lube on new seal. No Leaks.
https://www.tahoeyukonforum.com/threads/valley-cover-crank-pulley-etc.149036/

 

[thefrey]

@thefrey Because the front and rear covers are part of the oil pan sealing situation I was never sure which to install first. How was aligning the front cover with the oil pan in place, or did you loosen the oil pan?

I am not sure which you usually install first, but I had no issues getting my timing cover lined up with the oil pan installed. I didn’t have to loosen the oil pan, either. Just used the alignment tool and kept it in while I snugged everything up.

 

[thefrey]

Update for anyone curious:

Reinstalled timing cover using the front cover alignment tool. Got everything installed + new seal. Cleaned up the harmonic balancer with high grit sandpaper too.

Had to install a new radiator as my old one was leaking, so I guess I am happy that I had to drain most of the coolant to redo this anyways.

Have driven 2500 miles since and no leak from the front seal, so I am a happy camper. Thanks for all the help everyone.

It seems you can install the front cover without the tool, but I would argue that you should buy the tool.
from a young guy who hasn’t done this before.

 

[Dustin Jackson]

@thefrey Good update! Always worth posting an update, it’s frustrating to google a problem and you get to the end of the thread with no resolution