Hot oil Pressure fluctuation

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SnowDrifter

SnowDrifter

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Manual says I can use 0w30 if it's cold enough. There are a few times I'm in that neighborhood so I just run it for the winter. Hot viscosity on the oil I use is 12.2 so it's not a thin oil by any means.


I hope nothing is clogged in the pickup screen. The engine has been well maintained over the years


For the readouts, I use OBD2AA in conjunction with torque pro and android auto
 

afpj

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Wtf, it looks I duplicate posted multiple times..I only saw one earlier today, now I got many, sorry don’t know how to clean that up or how that happened.
Well, if anything’s dirty in the system, I hear that sea foam works wonders. I’ve never personally tried it though.
 
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SnowDrifter

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Had a thought. Constant displacement pumps generate pressure pulses yeah?

Is it possible that when cold, the oil is thick enough that the oil pump relief valve is open, acting as sort of a damper for those pulses. But while hot, that's not the case, and the variance in reading is caused by the refresh rate of the sensor combined with whether the pump is in a pressure pulse or not?


Will check tomorrow
 

afpj

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Uggh, fluid dynamics....

Although what you say in theory is true, I don’t think that the sensor is sensitive enough , or the sample rate fast enough, to be able to pick up fluctuations like that. Otherwise all of ours would be doing it, in theory. Perhaps you have a more theoretical rig than mine though. Mine leaks oil, so my leak is probably acting like a relief valve lol

Have you attached a “real gauge” to confirm the readings of your sending unit?
 
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SnowDrifter

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Follow up:

I replaced my oil pump w/ a melling m295HV, and pickup tube o ring.

I did some checking during tear down:

All Bolts were secure, no concerns with anything loose or out of torque.

Oil pump and block mating surface were in good condition with no pitting or erosion

Pickup tube o ring was soft and pliable, fit tightly. Screen was clear and free of any varnish. The tube was inspected for any cracks or other distortions. No concerns there.

Oil pump gear tolerances were 0.004" consistently across the gear set. Neither housing nor gears showed any marring or scoring.

High pressure bypass spring was visually intact with no distortions. I don't have the equipment to measure the spring rate so I can't glean any info there

The bypass piston showed some marring along its length in one spot, roughly 20 degrees along its axis. All other areas were in good condition and showed no visible signs of wear.

My suspicion is the piston was binding up on something. My fingers are too large to fit in the cylinder to feel for any flash or other machining errors.



When I replaced the pump with a high volume high pressure(spring) unit:

idle pressure when hot increased from ~29-33psi(fluctuating) to 48psi consistently

2k rpm hot oil Pressure increased from ~40(mean of fluctuations) to 65psi

Redline hot oil Pressure increased from 65(? Pressure swings too large to get any reasonable reading) to 110psi.


Oil used is Mobil 1 0w30 ESP.



I'm quite pleased with the outcome and am confident in marking this solved.

A few notes:

With higher flow, it's advisable to use a larger oil filter with more internal media to avoid the filter from going into bypass excessively. I use a Fram Xg3675 - a longer filter with synthetic media and a thick housing.

With 110psi, use a quality filter with a thick housing. You don't want it to blow out.

the job takes around 7 hours to complete, including supporting gaskets such as the oil cooler blockoff plate, which could be prone to leaking under the extra pressure if they're old. Everything will drio everywhere and you will make a huge mess. Bring lots of shop rags and a few crappy towels. I allotted myself 4 days. Day 1, let coolant drain, day 2, remove oil pan, let it drop out, day 3, do the job then let the rtv cure for 24h. Day 4. Fill everything up, test drive, and verify work

You will need a harmonic balancer puller and installer. It's press fit. The rent a tool installer from O'Reilly works if you get a 3" longer through bolt, otherwise it won't reach into the crank.

You'll need a means of aligning the front cover concentric to the crank shaft. I used a tool from sac city corvette. I found that threading the bolts into the front cover, wiggling the top from side to side, then moving it to the middle of the 2 limits of movement provided satisfactory alignment.

The front cover, gasket, and block surface all sit flush with one another. Don't forget the RTV on the corners!

A u joint and 1/4" ratchet with appropriate extensions is a life saver

You will need 2 people to remove, then torque the harmonic balancer. Holding the crank still can be accomplished by removing the inspection cover on the bell housing and inserting a medium sized pry bar into the flex plate. Mind the pry bar is kept square to the welds to avoid distorting it

The pickup tube o ring is a tight fit. You'll need to lubricate it and apply a fair bit of force for it to seat in the oil pump. The retaining bolt will NOT suck it in.




Uhh... That's all I got. Hopefully this helps anyone stumbling across this thread. I can do a descriptive write up if interested. No pics though
 
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SnowDrifter

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I thought this bit was just me until some friends pointed it out on their own

2 things I've noticed since getting some drive time on her

1. Cold start piston slap seems to be improved. I've never had it loud in my rig anyway, but it's nearly non-existant now. Best theory I have is there is there is some more oil slung onto the cylinder walls, providing a bit more cushion to the skirts. I suppose with that might come a potential for burning more oil if my oil control rings are worn out. I've out 600mi on it since the pump change, haven't noticed a drop in oil level. My rigs never been an oil burner, will post back when I get some more miles.

2. Smoother idle. This one I really can't account for and I don't believe it's from the oil pump, but rather something else in the process. My current guesses are, either the crank seal was leaking some vacuum, or possibly the old a/c tensioner was worse than I thought. Will check fuel trims with a scan tool next time I get a moment and update. Should tell whether it was the crank seal or the tensioner that did it. Unless there's some weird shit going on with the lifters.


I climbed a mountain pass at 4 to 4.2k rpm for a few mins today. Didn't encounter anything that could be considered sucking the pan dry. Normal drainage from the catch can, so that tells me it's coming out of the heads OK. I have an oil level sensor that sits a fair bit above the pickup tube level and that's never indicated anything to me either. I only add this piece because it's been a point of concern passed around various forums over the years, even if it's in a primarily racing context
 

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