Build Vs Buy (5.3 to 6.0)

[TxDrewski]

I love my Hoe.... I come from the diesel scene and next to my Lb7 that i sold, the Tahoe I have now has been my favorite vehicle Ive ever owned, and guys I have owned LOTS, (my girls 09 G8 GT is a close third ).

My Hoe has 138k on her and I drive 20k to 25k a year in the oil field. I have a newer truck to keep up with my employers vehicle policy, but we keep the miles off of it so we can trade it in in 4 years and repeat 4 years later. I drive my Tahoe because I love it and I want to keep it, not because I have too.

So I've been looking at saving for either a new crate engine (GM Performance Parts crate engine LS327/5.3L ** PN19165628), about $3500, or getting a nice used 6.0 and building it up... Here are my concerns and factors for purchase..

1.) Longevity.. I know on a smaller than 3500 budget i could build or buy a nice 6.0, however we are talking used block vs new block, and I would like to get about 200k to 250k outta my next engine with ease.
2.) Difficulty or ease of install... The crate engine, aside from the intake and a few other things i would have off of the old 5.3, seems to be just a drop in. With a 6.0 Im not sure what year/generation I would need to pick up to be able and do the same thing. I have the Z71 package, I'm also not sure if that would make a difference in the install of either.
3.) HP/TQ.. Id like to be in the 350 to 400HP range either way I go. Im getting some LT's on my current 5.3 and would likely want to use those on either route I decide to go.
4.) Price, too a degree
Obviously I dont mind spending the money to get what I want. 5000 is about where I wanna be after everything and that sure beats a down payment and note on a new truck, especially considering I really really like my tahoe..

Soooo, any thoughts or opinions would be really appreciated. Anyone that has done a swap or built an engine or bought a crate engine, what did you get, are you happy, what would you do differently?

Thnaks Guys and Gals

 

[ccapehartusarmyINF.(ret)]

always go with a new block over a used i was faced with a similar choice when i was building my mustang im glad i went with a brand new engine once i was done with it all
it ran like a striped ass ape

 

[TxDrewski]

Yeah I put a crate 5.0 in my 94 vert and the piece of mind was nice but I probably over paid for the engine... Definitely didnt get my money out of it when I sold it.

 

[ccapehartusarmyINF.(ret)]

my rule of thumb with most things is brand new is almost always better
hey is lufkin in a dry county

 

[TxDrewski]

Nope its a wet county as of 2010 I wanna say. Was dry up till then.

 

[livingez_123]

I will take a good seasoned used block any day, Then you go and deburr the entire block, do some work on the oil galley drains and also some massage work on the oil pan and the oil pump. Just because the block is used, doesn't mean it's bad.

 

[TxDrewski]

I will take a good seasoned used block any day, Then you go and deburr the entire block, do some work on the oil galley drains and also some massage work on the oil pan and the oil pump. Just because the block is used, doesn't mean it's bad.

In the 6.0, what year would I be looking to pull from?

 

[ccapehartusarmyINF.(ret)]

i realize used doesnt mean its bad i just tend to prefer new over used thats all
im not totally opposed to buying a used block especially if its significantly cheaper

yeah i got stuck in lufkin for a few days on my way home from basic training my grandperents 35 ft motor home blew a tire and when that happen the tireshop discovered all 6 tires were bad the steel belts were rusting or something they had to order 6 tires so there i was stuck fresh outta basic hadnt drank a beer in 16 weeks so i was eager to throw down some cold ones and holy shit its a dry county i was one pissed off grunt and the spirit crushing humidity didnt help either

 

[livingez_123]

01-06. you have the LQ4 and the LQ9. the LQ9 is a high compression version.

I knew it was LQ9, dont know why my brain made me push the 6 instead.

 

[TxDrewski]

01-06. you have the LQ4 and the LQ6. the LQ6 is a high compression version.

Gotcha thanks man. They bolt up to the 4l60 or only to the 3/4 ton trans?

 

[josueh95]

actually it is not an LQ6 its is an LQ9 which is found on escalades silverado SS and even on some 2500 silverados

 

[TxDrewski]

actually it is not an LQ6 its is an LQ9 which is found on escalades silverado SS and even on some 2500 silverados

Gotcha. So what route do you recommend Joseuh? I see your performance happy like me lol.

 

[jomulk56]

I'd build it from the block up personally. I don't think it matters if it's new or used unless you're buying it from a speed shop that's done everything you were going to anyways. Also, if it were me I'd do it right while it's out of the truck, even if that means it takes 3 years to build it.


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[digitalfiend]

This is a topic that is near and dear to my heart. I've been planning a wild LS build for a long time now so I've been researching LS rebuild options for a wihle.

Your power levels should be really be easy to hit if you go with some basic upgrades. Dyno-proven gains of up to 100hp above stock output are well documented with as little as headers and a cam upgrade.

I will take a good seasoned used block any day, Then you go and deburr the entire block, do some work on the oil galley drains and also some massage work on the oil pan and the oil pump. Just because the block is used, doesn't mean it's bad.

Regarding building on a used block or going with a new block, this is mainly a matter of opinion and preference...but I see eye-to-eye with livingez here - but only if you rebuild using an iron block. Hot rodders from the 60's would swear up and down that a used block was stronger than a new block due to the heating/cooling cycles that they go through. Another part of the "used versus new" argument from "back then" was due to the makeup of the metal...the manufacturers were trying different recipes for the metal for the blocks, so the early ones had different carbon content and metallurgy recipes, so the "newer" blocks (think 70's versus 60's) were a bit weaker. This metallurgy part doesn't apply as much today that I know of, but I do buy into the "seasoned" aspect.

As long as a block hasn't been destroyed by overheating or had a catastrophic failure of the rotating assembly then it'll be fine. A reputable machine shop that knows what they're doing when turning the crank and machining the cylinders (preferably with a torque plate) is the way to go when doing a build from a used block.

If you do upgrades to either form of the engine once it's bought or purchased, I'd recommend steering clear of using underdrive pulleys. I've read that swapping to a non-balanced underdrive crank pulley can cause premature wear and failure of the front crank bearing.

The biggest reason I would recommend rebuilding a used engine is that for a price similar to a crate engine you can rebuild with forged components. If you're selective with choosing your engine's internals you can end up with a lighter rotating assembly that's stronger than stock. A lighter rotating assembly frees up power that was previously spent moving a heaver assembly. Since it will be stronger you can boost it with a supercharger and really get into some serious fun.

 

[justinlw]

No one has mentioned a major difference between the two engines yet: The torque curve. This is what is pushing me towards the 6.0. You can pull big numbers on the dyno with either engine, but the 6 down where you actually need it for daily driving situations and towing. My biggest complaint with the 5.3 is the need to downshift at highway speeds on slight grades.

 

[digitalfiend]

No one has mentioned a major difference between the two engines yet: The torque curve. This is what is pushing me towards the 6.0. You can pull big numbers on the dyno with either engine, but the 6 down where you actually need it for daily driving situations and towing. My biggest complaint with the 5.3 is the need to downshift at highway speeds on slight grades.

I suspect that the increase in torque/hp is implied between the two which is why no one has commented on that much. Since you bring it up, it really depends upon the build you're planning on doing. If you're only going to rebuild a 5.3 to stock specs versus buying a crate 6.0, then I'd pick the 6.0.

However, if you're going to rebuild of "an engine", there's a lot of directions that one could go with. I guessed that you'd be buying the engine from craigslist or a salvage yard...if this is the case then you could pick up a used 6.0 and rebuild *that* engine. Are you going to run a supercharger or nitrous? If you're going N/A and rebuilding your existing 5.3 then you could always go with a stroker kit and make your 5.3 as big or bigger than a 6.0. Are you open to adding more than LT's to get more power?

Any aspect of this could make a rebuild (your 5.3 or another LS engine) better performing than a 6.0 crate engine. If you are expecting different input could you give us a better idea of what you're planning when you mention you're considering a rebuild.

 

[YukonXL04]

Well he is talking either buying a crate 5.3 vs building a 6.0. first if both were stock I would go with the 6.0, now adding mods to it and its a no brainer. go with the 6.0.

 

[josueh95]

id get a lightly used lq4 or lq9 for usually around 1100. for the price differene of the engines you can get the lq4 stripped down and worked on to be as good as new and still have the advantage of a 6.0 over a 5.3 to start with...from their with a cam headers tune and stall should be enough to put a good smile on your face..im thinking of picking up a 6.0 soon and swapping my cam over and doing some worked 243 heads

 

[justinlw]

I suspect that the increase in torque/hp is implied between the two which is why no one has commented on that much. Since you bring it up, it really depends upon the build you're planning on doing. If you're only going to rebuild a 5.3 to stock specs versus buying a crate 6.0, then I'd pick the 6.0.



However, if you're going to rebuild of "an engine", there's a lot of directions that one could go with. I guessed that you'd be buying the engine from craigslist or a salvage yard...if this is the case then you could pick up a used 6.0 and rebuild *that* engine. Are you going to run a supercharger or nitrous? If you're going N/A and rebuilding your existing 5.3 then you could always go with a stroker kit and make your 5.3 as big or bigger than a 6.0. Are you open to adding more than LT's to get more power?



Any aspect of this could make a rebuild (your 5.3 or another LS engine) better performing than a 6.0 crate engine. If you are expecting different input could you give us a better idea of what you're planning when you mention you're considering a rebuild.

I wasn't talking about the increase, more about where the torque is located in the rpm range. Either way, for a truck the 6.0l is an easy decision.

 

[FrankU]

Suggestion.............

http://high-performance-engines.com...?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ATK&Product_Code=HP93