Moog ball joints?

[Matthew Jeschke]

I have a horror story My truck has 230k miles on it original ball joints. They don't have play but 3 of them have ripped up boots. I wanted to replace with moog but got wrong part number on first. So I bought Orielly's house brand. The dust boot looked really chintzy but did the trick.

Next time around I ordered the correct, Moog upper ball joint for front control arm. Then the nightmare begins. First, I ordered the Moog because is a beefier ball joint, and appears to be a better dust boot design. The dust boot is fastened to the joint itself as apposed to the generic design where the boot was a separate part sandwiched between control arm and steering knuckle.

I went to install the Moog joint and broke my breaker bar on the ball joint press. It was hell to try and get it into the control arm. Then I realized Moog makes the joint slightly larger than the hole (unlike the generic one I bought). They put ridges on side of joint to re-seat the new joint in the control arm. I literally had to use a Dremel to open up the control arm seat a bit... Then a 4ft pipe to press the new joint in. At time I thought, well probably this is better although no going back after I've installed this.

It kept going in crooked though because it's a bit larger. I was constantly re-configuring the press to try and push on different sides of the joint so it would install evenly and seat on all sides.

Once it was in I went to install grease zerk only to realize all that fiddling to seat fully deformed the top cap where the zerk goes in. I had to seat the zerk with a hammer and then screw it in. This resulted in a functional but crooked grease zerk. Annoying but not critical.

Now for the moment of truth. The reason I bought the ball joint in the first place. That superior, integrated boot. I started greasing and the retainer clip for the boot failed. It would pop off, release all the grease, and then I'd fiddle forever trying to reassemble it with a small pick. I finally got the boot on and left the ball joint without grease as was impossible to grease the boot without the clip coming off (there's no grease relief on the boot).

I'm in a conundrum. I've noticed Moog has this standard practice of over-sizing their bushings, and ball joints. Now that I've installed their ball joint I cannot go back to another brand as I've resized the opening. And the dust boot design is completely flawed.

I've got a lower ball joint from Moog as well. However, I'm not sure I want to find out what it will be like once installed. Although it appears to have a completely different dust boot design. There's no retainer clip, it has a grease relief, and the boot appears to be much better integrated with the joint.

When I google this issue it appears as though I'm not alone. Folks get really upset at these joints around the time they have to start greasing them.

Any thoughts? Use the lower or throw it away? I literally may have to get a new upper control arm as a result of this mess

 

[Matthew Jeschke]

Curious, does the torsen bar need removed to replace the lower ball joint?

 

[SnowDrifter]

If memory serves you can do so without d/cing the torsion bars, but it's a fair bit easier to do so and well worth your time. Just grab one of the torsion key tools. The things won't take you but a few minutes to get to where you can work with them. Take the preload off, pop the height adjusters out, and just let the keys hang. Turn the bushings loose a turn or 2 and you'll have all the movement you need.

I'd replace the control arm at this point. The lower ball joint is load bearing. Not worth the risk to reuse in it's current state IMO

And TBH I wouldn't use moog stuff. I'm fairly disenchanted by them. Used their tie rods on my rig and I was wholly unimpressed with the build quality and results.


Auto parts store should be able to rent you both a ball joint press and torsion key tool

 

[camaroz1985]

I did a full front end rebuild last year using Moog parts. I had no such issues. I did replace the whole upper arm (only a few $ more than the joint, and you get new bushings too). The lower joint was not any harder than any other ball joint I have done, just used a rental tool from the local parts store. I didn't release the torsion bars, but because I was doing the upper ball joints and tie rods too, I just took the upright off so I had plenty of room.

 

[Matthew Jeschke]

Good point. Maybe i leave the bottom joints alone. I did like the moog sway bar links but everything else i have purchased from them has had horrible fitment issues.

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[96-2D-Hoe]

I just replaced most of my steering components and used all Moog with no issues whatsoever. It actually went smoother than I expected. Pitman, idler and bracket, inner and outer tie rods and adjusters, and a complete upper control arm.



Edit
Wrong forum tho. Mine is a 96

 

[swathdiver]

I think Chris, @iamdub recently bought some Chicom front suspension parts to try out. I don't know that I could trust your Moog fiasco by leaving it, might go OE.

 

[Matthew Jeschke]

I think Chris, @iamdub recently bought some Chicom front suspension parts to try out. I don't know that I could trust your Moog fiasco by leaving it, might go OE.

Yeah, for sure. I am afraid if i press in the next ball joint it might crack the control arm. They were that tight, even after reaming out the hole for the top one.

I also noticed some of the after market control arms are pressed steal as apposed to forged arms, as the stock ones are.

I like my moog parts don't get me wrong... just not the bushings or balljoints. Fitment is a nightmare and their proprietary dust boots are not all they are cracked up to be.

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[iamdub]

I think Chris, @iamdub recently bought some Chicom front suspension parts to try out. I don't know that I could trust your Moog fiasco by leaving it, might go OE.

Don't discredit them! They are AC DELCO Chicom parts!
Best I can put together from the parts I got and after some reading, is that the AC Delco Professional series stuff is the reboxed Moog/Chicom/whatever parts. I don't know who makes the "regular" AC Delco parts. I don't know if the greasable joints will be a blessing or a curse. It hardly matters as I expect the parts to last a long time since I put less than 7K miles on it in a year.

 

[Matthew Jeschke]

Don't discredit them! They are AC DELCO Chicom parts!
Best I can put together from the parts I got and after some reading, is that the AC Delco Professional series stuff is the reboxed Moog/Chicom/whatever parts. I don't know who makes the "regular" AC Delco parts. I don't know if the greasable joints will be a blessing or a curse. It hardly matters as I expect the parts to last a long time since I put less than 7K miles on it in a year.

I was woundering if ac delco pro was the same. Sure looks really similar.

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[Erickk120]

What were the ball joints part numbers? I went all moog and didn't experience anything alike, Mine actually went in pretty smooth, and embarrassed to say I had to take them out again because I screwed the orientation the first time, dont ask me how. To me the hardest part was removing the oe lower ones, what a pain since I didn't have a grinder on hand. Had to chizzle my way through.

I did do the upper control arms bushings, didnt touch the lower ones. Do you have steel or aluminum control arms?

 

[Matthew Jeschke]

What were the ball joints part numbers? I went all moog and didn't experience anything alike, Mine actually went in pretty smooth, and embarrassed to say I had to take them out again because I screwed the orientation the first time, dont ask me how. To me the hardest part was removing the oe lower ones, what a pain since I didn't have a grinder on hand. Had to chizzle my way through.

I did do the upper control arms bushings, didnt touch the lower ones. Do you have steel or aluminum control arms?

I think my control arms are steel. I put a picture of them on amazon on this post. K6540 is the moog part number that gave me all the trouble. It is the top control arm ball joint. The most unsettling thing is the dust boot slips off very very easily. Makes me reluctant to do the bottom one now. I have K6541 on yand for the bottom one.

Were those the same part numbers you have?

Have you had any issues now that they are installed?

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[Erickk120]

They are the same part number as mine which is weird. I didn't have a problem with the boot either. K6540 is the upper one and k6541 is the lower one, Lower is always bigger.
I'm genuinely curious if they are having quality control problems regarding their diameters, Wouldn't be surprised. I was able to put mine in place by hand, tap it and it would hold in place. I didn't even have to use a breaker bar that was for the lowers buttery smooth. Actually the upper one was tighter to get through, and it did fight me but i got it through it wanted to go crooked but I managed to correct it and I did use an extension for it.

 

[Matthew Jeschke]

Wild. Yeah must be a quality control issue at moog.

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[Matthew Jeschke]

Okay I rescind all the bad things I said about Moog ball joints including the countless swear words putting in the upper ball joint. I was shaken to say the least and a bit apprehensive to try the lower Moog ball joint but saw the part couldn't possibly have the same flaws as upper. The bottom joint went in silky smooth and couldn't have been an easier experience (aside from my trying to push the old one out the wrong way no further comment). My guess is the upper ball joint was flawed but that's what I get for ordering from Amazon's returned parts. A small price to pay for all the discounted parts, now the world knows my secret to rebuilding vehicles on a budget lol

 

[SnowDrifter]

from Amazon's returned parts.

I'm wondering if the ball joint you were intended to get, isn't the ball joint you got. Rebox mixup or something else altogether?

 

[Matthew Jeschke]

I'm wondering if the ball joint you were intended to get, isn't the ball joint you got. Rebox mixup or something else altogether?

Strong possibility.

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[Erickk120]

I mean, I wouldn't be surprised tbh. When I got mine they had been opened but everything was in there, and it checked out. That would be funny and sad if that was the case.

 

[Matthew Jeschke]

I mean, I wouldn't be surprised tbh. When I got mine they had been opened but everything was in there, and it checked out. That would be funny and sad if that was the case.

I actually ordered the upper and got the lower so I returned it. Then i saw a new return item upper was on amazon so i ordered it.

Turns out it was the lower one i mailed back so i just kept it and put it on [emoji52] that one went on easy.

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[Matthew Jeschke]

Here's the little papers came with the ball joints. Had some good tips on them. Least of which is, don't hit with a hammer. I found there is absolutely no need for a hammer if you setup the press correctly. The joints come right off. Despite my frustration, it really came down to putting press on correctly.

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