DOT Secretary Rolls Back All Emission Standards

[mountie]

I remember looking at "all the smog" against the L.A. hills in the east. The news described it as pollution. It was a orange looking color sky. In REALITY, it was only water vapor from moisture in the air.... Due to the breeze, moving from the 65 degree Pacific ocean air.
The Sun was setting..... showing a "sunset" color, and painting the air.

 

[Geotrash]

I see some crazy bad emissions stuff running away around work and it's a shame. I bet it's a years worth of car emmsions in a few hours of running for zero reason. but it's eaiser to chase the public than equipment even thou the company's have deep pockets and are to big to fail.

I honestly don't mind a yearly check to see if the check engine light is on type of thing. but there's a lot of stupid rules too. if a new cat fixes a check engine light. then who cares if it's got all expensive certifications. if you have a older classic or something they only gets driven a few 100 to a 1000 miles a year, who cares.
I would be highly pissed if I had to drop a car off at a shop for them to go thru it every year looking for issues. that's still kinda wild to me and reeks of fraud.

This is the thing. They call heavily polluting vehicles and equipment "gorillas" because their levels of emissions are enormous compared to a modern vehicle. The SULEV standards, which carmakers have been regularly meeting for 2 decades now, are equivalent to spilling a pint of gasoline on the ground in 100,000 miles of driving, in terms of unburned hydrocarbon emissions. Chasing the general public around the block who are driving anything made in the last 20 years seems a waste of time. Basic emissions tests every couple of years after the first 10, to make sure the most important equipment is still present and functioning, should suffice. Same with diesels, though I'd be perfectly happy with a stiff fine for rolling coal.

Basically, stop bothering people who are responsible and just trying to go about their lives with modern vehicles. Go after the gorillas.

 

[EvergreenZ71]

As someone who has not driven a car with fewer than 8 cylinders in the past 10yrs as a primary vehicle… I definitely like my displacement BUT do appreciate the efficiency of some of the smaller engines. I do not understand why there has not been a bigger push to hybridize more big vehicles? I understand we can all say we don’t like regulation telling us what to do or control our buying habits but where is the common sense engineering?
I think I’ve said this before that these big SUVs would be perfect candidates for big hybrid power trains. Increase power and efficiency. Yes, complications and potentially price but it can’t be that much more, ford and Toyota both by hybrid systems in their trucks. I bet another generation of research will have the trucks with mid-20s on MPG.

Oil/fuel prices aren’t high enough yet to drive consumer purchasing decisions yet, I guess?

I believe in free choice on business and personal purchase but there is a level of social responsibility businesses should have to shape the world they operate in… sorry… I’m a dreamer of a utopia that may not exist lol

I’ve also thought that the manufacturers were missing the mark on hybrid trucks.

Trains and ships run high torque engines full time to electric motors. Why not a little 2L high torque diesel running the entire time the truck is in operation supplying electricity to all 4 wheels?

This shouldn’t even need fancy batteries if the engine is supplying the power the whole time. Even with a dual battery the engine compartments on our trucks would be less full, engine cooling more efficient, and weight distribution would be better while maintaining or increasing the vehicle range everyone cites as the first fault in electric vehicles while concurrently eliminating their charging time delays.

My only question on this concept is wondering if the electric wheel motors actually have sufficient wheel torque for 4x4 use or hauling in more than 1/2 ton trucks after watching a cybertruck hill climb fail video on FB:

https://fb.watch/xwI7kPZeSO

 

[Dustin Jackson]

Like every other aspect of society, we the common folk are burdened with carrying the load.

Regulate cargo ship and large equipment emissions? Nope let's pick on the V8s.

Tax corporations and the rich more? Nope let's pick on the those that are working hard for their money.

 

[Bigburb3500]

I’ve also thought that the manufacturers were missing the mark on hybrid trucks.

Trains and ships run high torque engines full time to electric motors. Why not a little 2L high torque diesel running the entire time the truck is in operation supplying electricity to all 4 wheels?

This shouldn’t even need fancy batteries if the engine is supplying the power the whole time. Even with a dual battery the engine compartments on our trucks would be less full, engine cooling more efficient, and weight distribution would be better while maintaining or increasing the vehicle range everyone cites as the first fault in electric vehicles while concurrently eliminating their charging time delays.

My only question on this concept is wondering if the electric wheel motors actually have sufficient wheel torque for 4x4 use or hauling in more than 1/2 ton trucks after watching a cybertruck hill climb fail video on FB:

https://fb.watch/xwI7kPZeSO

You are not wrong at all. I think making it even simpler and doing accessory based motors would be sufficient for efficiency and torque. Again, look at the new Toyotas. It’s not really all that more “efficient” as they designed it for power but not having a stupid stop/go system that has to restart vs using the motor to get moving and letting the engine “catch up” when it’s ready makes too much sense to me. No one asked me tho…

 

[homesick]

I'd think the stop/start system is mostly forced by the economy regulations.

joe

 

[B-train]

I was hoping this would happen. Now, just mandate that MPG is the key metric, and the rest will follow. SO much is lost in the name of "clean air." Keeping cats hot, keeping DOCs hot, regen systems, all the BS.

The injection systems and PCMs of today are so robust that the control per millisecond is bananas. Optimal efficiency WITH clean air is possible. This isn't the 70's and 80's with anemic diesels and BS carburetors with electronic enrichment controls. It's like comparing a DOS computer system to a new Android phone - light years ahead.

Dump the EPA BS from 2001 and newer in the garbage can and you have a plan for good stuff.

 

[B-train]

Also to note, a 2005 Impala with a 3.8L was considered an ULEV........then they screwed up and junked an indestructible engine because it wasn't "clean" enough for the next "standard." Now we have 4 cylinders that hope to get less mass moving and maintained at speed that get the same as a V6 with a full sized car. Dismantle the EPA
.........they have outlived their usefulness by many years.

 

[j91z28d1]

This is the thing. They call heavily polluting vehicles and equipment "gorillas" because their levels of emissions are enormous compared to a modern vehicle. The SULEV standards, which carmakers have been regularly meeting for 2 decades now, are equivalent to spilling a pint of gasoline on the ground in 100,000 miles of driving, in terms of unburned hydrocarbon emissions. Chasing the general public around the block who are driving anything made in the last 20 years seems a waste of time. Basic emissions tests every couple of years after the first 10, to make sure the most important equipment is still present and functioning, should suffice. Same with diesels, though I'd be perfectly happy with a stiff fine for rolling coal.

Basically, stop bothering people who are responsible and just trying to go about their lives with modern vehicles. Go after the gorillas.

in my field even if the big name companies replace the old badly running heavy polluters. it's just sold to the contractors and they use them to under cut the costs of keeping work in house by buying the old equipment for scrap metal prices while the big companys have to buy the new surff at 300k a pop and go thru the pain of everything new we get is full of bugs and crap.

its all pretty stupid really.

 

[Fless]

FWIW the EPA sets the emissions standards, and the NHTSA sets the CAFE (Corporate Average Fuel Economy) standards.

 

[mountie]

Today I used Google Maps to see how long a drive in Switzerland ( Zurich airport to Morschach / on the river)....

Travel agent said the time-distance was around 45 minutes.... as per the map.

Google Maps claimed around 3 1/2 hours, to 5 1/2 hours.... ( I thought, "What ? " )...
Then I noticed... in Europe, Google is not allowed to calculate distance via an AUTOMOBILE.... ( Not available ) Huh ???

They only calculate by bus, bicycle, ... HUH ??? No cars ??? What a fri g 'in joke !!

 

[homesick]

in my field even if the big name companies replace the old badly running heavy polluters. it's just sold to the contractors and they use them to under cut the costs of keeping work in house by buying the old equipment for scrap metal prices while the big companys have to buy the new surff at 300k a pop and go thru the pain of everything new we get is full of bugs and crap.

its all pretty stupid really.

It's similar with class 8 trucks. When they're replaced, they're not scrapped and replaced with new 'green' trucks. They're sold to smaller companies, foreign and domestic.

Also, as a reminder, 'green' enthusiasts want to ban black vehicles [in CA], and cow poots.

joe

 

[j91z28d1]

Today I used Google Maps to see how long a drive in Switzerland ( Zurich airport to Morschach / on the river)....

Travel agent said the time-distance was around 45 minutes.... as per the map.

Google Maps claimed around 3 1/2 hours, to 5 1/2 hours.... ( I thought, "What ? " )...
Then I noticed... in Europe, Google is not allowed to calculate distance via an AUTOMOBILE.... ( Not available ) Huh ???

They only calculate by bus, bicycle, ... HUH ??? No cars ??? What a fri g 'in joke !!

it's been years now, but I drove all over Europe in a rental. maps worked just find. it was very enjoyable. I take it poor people don't really have cars and the autobahn while it's the name of the interstate within Germany. the system runs all over, just with some max speed limts but kept up just as well.. while it was mostly a toll road it was beautiful maintain and run. picked the rental up in Munich airport Chrisman eve, drove to Venice for a few days, and then back to Monaco for new years eve with random stops along the way. after new years made the drive up to Frankfurt airport thru the alps to fly home. Google maps got us all over just fine by car.

they do say by Europe by train is epic, but I very much enjoyed our little manual tranny Ford rental car. I was sitting on the speed limiter around 105 at night on the Autobahn and a big body Benz passed me like I was doing 40. dude had to be rolling 140 off into the night. miss traveling around on random adventures.

 

[j91z28d1]

It's similar with class 8 trucks. When they're replaced, they're not scrapped and replaced with new 'green' trucks. They're sold to smaller companies, foreign and domestic.

Also, as a reminder, 'green' enthusiasts want to ban black vehicles [in CA], and cow poots.

joe

I wooldnt call anything we have green haha. but they do use a lot less fuel, and since they are more reliable. they don't get them fired up at 4am and run till 10am "just incase" they won't be ready when needed. now days they atleast expect the new stuff will fire up and be ready within 30mins as needed. I still feel the old stuff was more reliable haha. atleast it was easier for me to get up and running. the new stuff fails, I'm like year. engineering doesn't open till 8am. it's a paper weight till I can talk to them. but it's perception that matters I guess

 

[homesick]

it's been years now, but I drove all over Europe in a rental. maps worked just find. it was very enjoyable. I take it poor people don't really have cars and the autobahn while it's the name of the interstate within Germany. the system runs all over, just with some max speed limts but kept up just as well.. while it was mostly a toll road it was beautiful maintain and run. picked the rental up in Munich airport Chrisman eve, drove to Venice for a few days, and then back to Monaco for new years eve with random stops along the way. after new years made the drive up to Frankfurt airport thru the alps to fly home. Google maps got us all over just fine by car.

they do say by Europe by train is epic, but I very much enjoyed our little manual tranny Ford rental car. I was sitting on the speed limiter around 105 at night on the Autobahn and a big body Benz passed me like I was doing 40. dude had to be rolling 140 off into the night. miss traveling around on random adventures.

We worked a job in SW Germany. One guy spent his weekends exploring Europe by train. He loved it.

My bud and I rented a Mercedes and explored some Germany, Belgium, and France; and yeah, the Autobahn we saw was very well kept [but no tolls that I remember].

We were told that the excellent condition of the Autobahn was because contractors had to warranty the road for a very long time. I don't really remember the warranty duration, but it seems like it was somewhere in the 10-20 year range.

joe

 

[mountie]

I wooldnt call anything we have green haha. but they do use a lot less fuel, and since they are more reliable. they don't get them fired up at 4am and run till 10am "just incase" they won't be ready when needed. now days they atleast expect the new stuff will fire up and be ready within 30mins as needed. I still feel the old stuff was more reliable haha. atleast it was easier for me to get up and running. the new stuff fails, I'm like year. engineering doesn't open till 8am. it's a paper weight till I can talk to them. but it's perception that matters I guess

Back in 1997, I flew into Belgium, drove to Brugge, then Paris, down along the French riviera , through Italy, , up into Switzerland then Germany..... It was a great 3 week trip...... Loved the roads..... Back then Google Maps didn't edit your preferences..... as per the EU requires now.