Transmission Rebuild, Collapsed Lifter Debacle - Opinions Needed

[16Tahohoho]

Hello All!

I've done quite a bit of reading through various threads here and based on my somewhat unique situation, want to seek opinions on what has transpired and options to consider from where I'm at. Long, winding, story short......started feeling loss of power/shudder under load on our 16' Tahoe (5.3). Took to shop, they ran codes and determined it was a trans issue (I assumed misfire initially). They recommended me to their preferred trans rebuild partner locally and that shop confirmed it was indeed a trans issue due to the torque converter clutch failing. We were quoted ~$5,300 to include a billett torque converter, TCM, steels and bonded piston kit, 3-5 rev drum, etc. along with a reschedule of the TCM to only have the clutch engage from 5th gear and above. Rebuild went seemingly well with good communication from the shop around the Thanksgiving holiday.

The day we were expected to pick up the vehicle we received a call from the shop owner (who we'd been communicating with the entire time), explaining a situation in which our check engine light had come on. The tech took the vehicle out for a test drive, the check engine light came on and the vehicle was immediately returned to the shop. They were unsure what the issue was, so the owner then took the vehicle for a test drive himself. He drove 7-10 miles without issue and reported good operation of the rebuilt trans, and no check engine light. Closer back to the shop, he admitted that due to a traffic/intersection situation (I gathered it was a merging issue) he "really got on it" and "was really aggressive with the vehicle". Directly after the check engine light came on and by the time he got the vehicle back to the shop it was "almost undriveable". They placed the scanner on it, and got back a multiple misfire code. They spent some time trying to diagnose what might be the issue, but they are a transmission specific shop. They took the car to the mechanic shop they share a parking lot with and their team assumed it was a broken rocker arm (due to the noise I assume).

The trans shop owner immediately filed a claim with his insurance company who sent a forensic mechanic out to inspect the issue. Supposedly that inspection report (they won't share with me) states there is #7 cylinder misfire due to a collapsed lifter. Due to the fact this is a known issue with these engines and that GM issued a service bulletin for it in 23', that they would deny coverage of his claim. They supposedly took an oil sample and state that the oil is clean, and that the repair would entail new lifters and pushrods only.

The owner states he is not liable for the engine damage "because it would have happened anyway", and that I must pay him in full for the trans rebuild (i've paid ~50%). His only compromise is offering an additional year and double mileage (12 mo./12k ---> 24 mo./24k) on his trans warranty. I've spoken with a local shop I trust who won't even touch the repair due to mileage (~155k), and the dealership we purchased from as a certified pre-owned in 17' (22k miles when purchased). Dealership quoted $8k for lifters/pushrods, $12k if we include cam, and ~$16k for a reman. engine replacement with 3yr/100k warranty (non-transferrable).

1. Thoughts on if, and to what degree, the trans shop is liable for this engine damage after being "very aggressive" with the vehicle after knowledge of the check engine light being on?
2. At $5k for the trans and $8-$16k ($13k-$21k) in repair costs.....how does this impact resale value and is it worth it to complete? Again, wife is ready for a newer vehicle.

Recommendations on next steps??? Thanks in advance for the input!

 

[Bigburb3500]

Whoa. I’m not even sure what to tell you on this. Depending on the state this would be past small claims court.

You MIGHT want to pay the small consultation fee and review your options with a lawyer. $10k+ bill with a reason of “It would have happened anyways” is not always a real reason but the first response insurance companies give.

 

[Joseph Garcia]

Welcome to the Forum from NH.

Lots of knowledgeable folks here who freely share their knowledge, experiences, and perspectives. Knowledge is power.

I hope that you will become a participating member in the Forum's discussions.

Pics of the truck, please.

What a mess of a situation.

"Wife is ready for a newer vehicle." IMO, she's never going to be fully happy with this truck again, and I suspect that you will feel the same. Happy Wife = Happy Life.

I suggest that you get what you can for the truck in its current condition, as there are always folks out there who would take this truck on as a personal project vehicle. Then, get another vehicle that your wife likes.

 

[ReaperHWK]

I would have gotten a new one as soon as the tranny failed at that mileage.

Right now you’re in a tough spot paying much more than the car is worth for the repairs.

IMO 12k into that means you need to keep it for a much longer time. Will your wife be happy with that?

It may still not be to late to cut your losses and move on.

 

[SpareParts]

I wonder what would have happened if the lifter failed 2 hours after you got the vehicle back. How many miles are on the vehicle?
Being very aggressive (WOT) on the vehicle should not be a problem.
GM has set a max rpm in the engine tune that should not cause damage to the engine.
Just because it failed when he was aggressive with the throttle does not mean it was not already 99% failed and would have broke 2 hours after you got it back.
This is a known issue and the vehicle is designed to run at WOT without damage.
IMHO, the transmission shop was driving the vehicle in a manner it was designed to do. Being aggressive on the throttle should not be a problem as the vehicle is designed to do that.
If you believe you deserve compensation for a widely known issue you should contact GM about this known manufacturer defect.
I do not think you should blame the transmission shop for a known GM lifter issue that can fail at any time.

 

[16Tahohoho]

All fair points above, and thanks for the input and feedback so far. I did get some online legal advice which leads me to believe there is possibility of a case, but not sure its worth pursuing. This is a 16' LT with essentially everything a LTZ would have (less chrome accents), so It does have a sunroof, 22" wheels and the pearlized "white" paint. Really sharp looking, hate to see it go, but we already have a couple extra vehicles and kids won't be old enough to drive for 7-8yrs. Just seems a bit odd to have gotten no codes from the mechanic prior to taking it to the trans shop, and then in a matter of 10-15 miles of driving it suffers catastrophic failure.

Pretty wild that I don't really have any pics of my own vehicle, but I guess I never really looked at it in that way (as I would one of my classics).

As stated, I'm new here.....but likely we'll replace with another Tahoe, Yukon, or Escalade so I'll hang around. Is there a Buy/Sell section, I haven't looked around enough yet :-(.

Thanks again!

 

[Fless]

This is a 16' LT with essentially everything a LTZ ....

TIP: Kind of a sidebar but when abbreviating a year, the apostrophe goes before the digits, since the first part of the year is what's being truncated. While it could potentially be a 16-ft LT, that's probably not what you meant.

 

[16Tahohoho]

TIP: Kind of a sidebar but when abbreviating a year, the apostrophe goes before the digits, since the first part of the year is what's being truncated. While it could potentially be a 16-ft LT, that's probably not what you meant.

Ha, good call.....too much swirling in my head right now to think straight. Yes its a '16

 

[Coveman]

That’s a nightmare, sorry to hear about your predicament. I don’t think a legal remedy will give you much relief as it will be tough to prove the shop’s negligence and even if you won a settlement receiving restitution is far from guaranteed.

How are the transmission shop reviews? Any other customers with similar stories? You should leave a fair review as well.

I’d take the truck to a independent mechanic to get another opinion, hopefully another set of professional eyes (without a franchise fee that drives costs up) might find another course of action that is far more affordable.

Selling a non-drivable rig will probably bring some lowball bids, but with the repair costs hovering at replacement cost you’d really need to be committed to wanting to keep the truck for a while.

 

[Donal]

Where is the vehicle located?

 

[SpareParts]

All fair points above, and thanks for the input and feedback so far. I did get some online legal advice which leads me to believe there is possibility of a case, but not sure its worth pursuing. This is a 16' LT with essentially everything a LTZ would have (less chrome accents), so It does have a sunroof, 22" wheels and the pearlized "white" paint. Really sharp looking, hate to see it go, but we already have a couple extra vehicles and kids won't be old enough to drive for 7-8yrs. Just seems a bit odd to have gotten no codes from the mechanic prior to taking it to the trans shop, and then in a matter of 10-15 miles of driving it suffers catastrophic failure.

Pretty wild that I don't really have any pics of my own vehicle, but I guess I never really looked at it in that way (as I would one of my classics).

As stated, I'm new here.....but likely we'll replace with another Tahoe, Yukon, or Escalade so I'll hang around. Is there a Buy/Sell section, I haven't looked around enough yet :-(.

Thanks again!

How many miles are on your vehicle?
There is always of possibility of a case against the transmission shop. Pretty much anyone can sue anyone over anything.
Probably just me but i could never sue the transmission shop for the failed lifter.
They did not do any work on the engine. The failed lifter is an interior mechanical part that is prone and well documented failure point even with little ole ladies driving to church on Sunday morning at 25 mph.
In your posts, i just don't see anything the transmission shop did wrong.
Can you sue them, sure ya can.
Is it the right thing to do, Not in my opinion but im nobody important at all.

 

[West 1]

When I installed my new 6L80 with a new TECHM the learning program asked me to do a few full throttle accelerations so the new TECHM could learn that protocol. I don't usually run full throttle but maybe the engine failed when they did the tranny learning and revving to red line was more than your old lifter could take? It is a normal part of the tranny tune as far as I know. Maybe Nick will jump in and educate us.

Lousy as the situation is I do not think the shop is at fault. These lifters are well known to fail. My Neighbor is furious right now, her 2018 Silverado with 75,000 miles on it just lost a lifter. It happens.

 

[16Tahohoho]

That’s a nightmare, sorry to hear about your predicament. I don’t think a legal remedy will give you much relief as it will be tough to prove the shop’s negligence and even if you won a settlement receiving restitution is far from guaranteed.

How are the transmission shop reviews? Any other customers with similar stories? You should leave a fair review as well.

I’d take the truck to a independent mechanic to get another opinion, hopefully another set of professional eyes (without a franchise fee that drives costs up) might find another course of action that is far more affordable.

Selling a non-drivable rig will probably bring some lowball bids, but with the repair costs hovering at replacement cost you’d really need to be committed to wanting to keep the truck for a while.

Agree, probably just gonna bite the bullet and pay him and get it towed to the house. Great reviews and honestly he's been very communicative and great to work with through all of it. Local shop that's done work on multiple vehicles for my dad wouldn't even touch it. They were concerned it had wiped the shaft and there would be metal in all the oil canals.

Can a shade tree mechanic take this on? Looks like a pretty intensive job......Would a DOD/AFM delete kit from Texas Speed (or otherwise) be the way to go?

 

[16Tahohoho]

How many miles are on your vehicle?
There is always of possibility of a case against the transmission shop. Pretty much anyone can sue anyone over anything.
Probably just me but i could never sue the transmission shop for the failed lifter.
They did not do any work on the engine. The failed lifter is an interior mechanical part that is prone and well documented failure point even with little ole ladies driving to church on Sunday morning at 25 mph.
In your posts, i just don't see anything the transmission shop did wrong.
Can you sue them, sure ya can.
Is it the right thing to do, Not in my opinion but im nobody important at all.

Its right at 155k.

I don't disagree with your opinion, and have been wrestling with this myself. I'm guessing what led me down this path was him stating that he'd driven it aggressively and saying multiple times how he'd really gotten on it while knowing the check engine light was on from the prior drive as his tech reported to him.

It is what it is. A real difficult spot, which is why I came here to get opinions of folks that spend time in these engines/trans both for a living and as a hobby. Everyone has been very helpful and provided great insight and opinion. I greatly appreciate that!

 

[16Tahohoho]

Where is the vehicle located?

Charlotte

 

[16Tahohoho]

Bit the bullet yesterday afternoon and paid the trans shop. Had the Tahoe picked up and towed to a trusted shop who is diagnosing. They verbally quoted ~$2,750 to replace lifters (plus any needed pushrods), and ~$8,500 if they determined the cam lobe to be damaged.

Fingers crossed for less than $3k and a working vehicle again! They don't do DOD/AFM delete. I assume there is a ecm tune that can be done just to bypass the DOD/AFM all together?

 

[SpareParts]

I can't believe the price shops charge for a DOD delete and cam swap. I have done 3 for 1K with parts supplied, including turning off DOD with Hp Tuners.
I might need to rethink my price.

 

[clogan2]

FWIW, here's my 2¢...
I also have a '16 Tahoe. It's an LTZ that I bought new, and it now has 142,000 miles. We love it. When my engine/tranny crash (and I'm sure it will happen eventually), I'm having replacements installed. A new equivalent Tahoe would be $100,000 or so. For the cost of a replacement engine/transmission, I get to keep driving my favorite vehicle for MUCH less than the cost of a new one.

Time may change my mind, but that's where I am right now.

 

[georgerenner]

Bit the bullet yesterday afternoon and paid the trans shop. Had the Tahoe picked up and towed to a trusted shop who is diagnosing. They verbally quoted ~$2,750 to replace lifters (plus any needed pushrods), and ~$8,500 if they determined the cam lobe to be damaged.

Fingers crossed for less than $3k and a working vehicle again! They don't do DOD/AFM delete. I assume there is a ecm tune that can be done just to bypass the DOD/AFM all together?

My son's 2009 Escalade had what we think was a AFM/stuck lifter. Tried ATF fluid and valvoline restore and after a short amount of time the noise went away. Put in a Range AFM delete chip and haven't heard from it since. Stuck lifters may be able to be "unstuck" using this method, worked for us. Our motto, well if it is already broke, but it still runs, then it ain't that broke. Also, I had the 6l80 rebuilt in my 2011 Yukon Denali and the Trans shop flashed my ecm and deleted the AFM as part of the package. I paid around 5G's for the rebuilt trans but I love the performance! Good luck!

 

[fozzi58]

I personally would keep it. I bought a 2017 new and it will probably be the last new vehicle I purchase. The cost of these rigs are astronomical now. If the underside of your truck is in good shape and you have kept up with typical maintenance - bushings, shocks, fluid changes, etc, then fix it an keep it. $5k for trans and $8k for a mechanical DOD delete is less than a reasonable down payment on a new truck unless you are OK with $1200 month payments for 84 months.

You can always upgrade the radio or put some fresh seat covers in it to "change it up".