KYB or Bilstein?

[kuhdwi]

I have a 2003 Tahoe LS 4x4. 196,000 miles, original shocks. 90% on road, highway use, some off road gravel or dirt.
This is also my trailer tow vehicle.
Are KYB Mono max series shocks or Bilstein 4600 series shocks the better choice?
Standard suspension, no air or auto leveling system on unit.

 

[OR VietVet]

I chose the KYB shocks all the way around and have been happy. I have had Bilstein's and liked them too. I would be happy with either.

 

[kuhdwi]

Which KYB did you get? Mono max?

 

[Fless]

Be careful with the shocks; if you have ZW7/G65 Premium Smooth Ride RPO codes the shocks and rear springs are different from the other suspensions.

 

[RAMurphy]

Concur with Fless. Make sure you upgrade your springs if you have the listed RPO code. I use Bilstein shocks and the upgraded rear springs. Quite happy with that setup.

 

[kuhdwi]

Be careful with the shocks; if you have ZW7/G65 Premium Smooth Ride RPO codes the shocks and rear springs are different from the other suspensions.

Yes I have the ZW7 suspension code. I plan to buy from rockauto, and they specified not for lifted use or premium ride system. KYB official site also gave me the same part numbers as rockauto. Do you know what to look for in upgrading the rear springs? Main reason I am replacing shocks is rolling like a boat under certain conditions. I have 197000 mile on the rig, hoping for 250000 before retiring.

 

[kuhdwi]

Be careful with the shocks; if you have ZW7/G65 Premium Smooth Ride RPO codes the shocks and rear springs are different from the other suspensions.

Concur with Fless. Make sure you upgrade your springs if you have the listed RPO code. I use Bilstein shocks and the upgraded rear springs. Quite happy with that setup.

As I answered Fless, I have the ZW7/G65 listed RPO code. Do you have a suggesstion on upgrading the rear springs? This is my travel trailer toter, and I do use a weight distributing hitch with it. I plan to use KYB Mono Max shocks from rockauto, they specified the same part numbers as the KYB official site.

 

[Fless]

You do have auto leveling if the OE rear shocks have never been changed.

To explain a little more, the G65 RPO code designates Nivomat technology shocks on the rear, and those are manual self-leveling. They are beefy shocks that adjust to the load as you drive. They are paired with softer springs, hence the Premium Smooth Ride (PSR) designation. If you replace them with standard shocks you'll need to replace the springs with either Z71 (non PSR) springs or what Bilstein indicates (199021), and those stiffer springs would work with standard shocks. But you lose the self-adjusting feature of the Nivomats. (I'm not sure if there is a third style of spring for this model year.) Not changing the springs when converting to standard shocks will cause dangerous sway under normal driving conditions.

Is there something wrong with your Nivomats? I use my '04 to tow a rental camper every year, at times without a WDH, depending of course on the tongue weight of the trailer. They level up within a couple of blocks of towing. You can test them by measuring a point on the rear bumper with no load, then tossing it 200-400 lbs of stuff in the back and measuring again, then take it for a short drive of a few blocks. Return to the same spot and measure again to see if they've brought up the back end of the truck to a decent level.

Having said that, I have replaced the front shocks with KYB Gas-A-Just KG5040s and am happy with them for retaining the PSR. Stay away from the KYB Excel-G bottom of the line shocks.

Pic of Nivomat shock:

 

[RAMurphy]

I replaced my Nivomat shocks so many years ago I can’t remember. My issue was due to the driver side shock leaking. When I was told the cost of replacements I literally chocked. It was this forum that I learned about the need to change the springs if I did not go with the Nivomat. I went the Bilstein route usising the springs recommended by Bilstein (199021) and this forum. Like I said couldn’t be happier and we tow a camper all he time.

 

[BoatyMcBoatface]

I removed the magnaride shocks and monomax all around. Rides great. Just make sure you order the correct front shock top bushings because the ones that come with the shock are crap.

 

[afpj]

Fless, I ordered the kyb kg5040 for my fronts as well, having my an oem pair up front now. When I took off the oem, it has some plastic collar for the top mount, and the oem bushings have a larger hole to accommodate that collar. The kyb bushings don’t have that. Kyb bushings have this little extra lip that I guess is suppose to fit in the upper shock mount hole in the frame? That lip was too wide diameter to fit in the hole, I wasn’t sure how that setup was going to keep the upper shock in position. Hope that made sense. 2002 Yukon with zw7/g65. I couldn’t find a front oem replacement on rock auto or Amazon. the rears replaced with nivomats again already. Any advice appreciated, hopefully this helps the OP too, but maybe everyone is just smarter than me.

 

[Fless]

Fless, I ordered the kyb kg5040 for my fronts as well, having my an oem pair up front now. When I took off the oem, it has some plastic collar for the top mount, and the oem bushings have a larger hole to accommodate that collar. The kyb bushings don’t have that. Kyb bushings have this little extra lip that I guess is suppose to fit in the upper shock mount hole in the frame? That lip was too wide diameter to fit in the hole, I wasn’t sure how that setup was going to keep the upper shock in position. Hope that made sense. 2002 Yukon with zw7/g65. I couldn’t find a front oem replacement on rock auto or Amazon. the rears replaced with nivomats again already. Any advice appreciated, hopefully this helps the OP too, but maybe everyone is just smarter than me.

I'm having a hard time picturing your setup, but it seems like it should be the same as mine. These shocks' top mounts have standard bushings over and under with the metal cups to support each one, with the truck mount sandwiched in-between.

If you have a pic, post it. I'll see if I can get one of mine later on today.

 

[afpj]

Hopefully you can see the screenshots. I took these off rockauto and these upper insulators are what the oem setup has. There's a rigid collar that sits in the bushing. The kybs don't use anything like that collar. The stem of the shock sits inside the collar.

 

[OR VietVet]

If the shock stem is a tight fit, just use the bushing but if not, the metal collar should be used. If the collar fits the stem of the new shock, I would use it, but if not, just use the bushing. Are you 100% on the shock application?

 

[Fless]

I'm not sure if this answers your question, but here are two pics from the KYB instructions. The bushings they provide don't have a metal sleeve which is not uncommon.

When you assemble the bushings on the shock, put the metal cup (necessary to support the bushing) on first, then a bushing with the flat side to the metal cup (might have to kind of screw it on since it will probably be tight). Then stick the threaded shock shaft through the mount. Put the top bushing on the shaft, then the metal cup.

Here's mine so you can see the top bushing and cup. The bushing under the mount is hidden, of course, by the shape of the mount.

 

[afpj]

The metal/plastic oem collar won't fit the new kyb bushings, as the latter's hole will just fit the shock stem, not the collar. The OEM setup is such that the stem sits inside that collar, and the collar sits inside the bushing, as well as the mounting hole. Sorry, wish I am able to show pictures better. I'm just not understanding how the new bushings center the stem. In one of the pics you supplied, it shows the bushing sitting in the mount hole, with a part of that bushing just fitting into the frame hole. The bushing i got has an extension for that purpose, but it's just a little too wide to fit into that mounting hole. I hope that made sense.

 

[Fless]

Use the KYB bushings. Each bushing should have a flat side and a side that has a small protrusion -- for lack of a better term -- that mates with the mount.

 

[Fless]

The protrusion on the bushings mates with the hole in the mount and centers (and buffers) the shock mounting stem so it's not hitting the sides of the metal hole. Once the stem is tightened down the bushing should be fully contacting the mount surface, with the protrusions fully inside the mount hole.

 

[afpj]

I understand now...that's what I was thinking...I guess those protrusions squish in the hole once I tighten down. I was thinking they should at least fit in the hole without tightening first, and was actually contemplating dremeling down the radius a little to fit. Well gents, another closed case, no thanks to me being just an idjut.

TYF FTW!

 

[Fless]

The bushings should fit into the hole, maybe snugly, without any trimming. Are you sure the mounting point hole is clear, no rust, etc.?