Collapsed Lifter - After 3000 miles!

[Skatejosh369]

So, I am stuck trying to figure out what has caused a lifter to collapse once again on me. Roughly 3200 miles ago, I replaced all lifters when I had one collapse at 200k miles, along with the cam. At this mileage, I didn't think too much of it, and just figured it was a common thing to happen at 200k.

Now, after 3200~ miles put on it after replacing all of the lifters, I had one go once again (I haven't pulled the heads, but I am thinking it is the same lifter). If a lifter is going to be bad, I would think it would be bad at the time in install and not 3200~ miles later. This is where I am struggling. What further could cause it? Clogged oil galley? A rough spot where lifter is (granted, the old lifter that was collapsed didn't have any scratches on it).

Has anyone had this happen to them this quickly? I replaced all so I wouldn't have to do this job again soon vs just replacing the one (1) that was bad.

Any input on this would be greatly appreciated!

 

[swathdiver]

Was it an AFM lifter that collapsed last time? Did you replace the VLOM with the latest version? Did you replace the AFM lifters with the latest Delphi II design? Did you delete AFM and install an aftermarket camshaft?

What codes are you getting?

 

[Skatejosh369]

Was it an AFM lifter that collapsed last time? Did you replace the VLOM with the latest version? Did you replace the AFM lifters with the latest Delphi II design? Did you delete AFM and install an aftermarket camshaft?

What codes are you getting?

I did not replace the VLOM, due to me not doing my homework before I did the job. It was an AFM lifter that did collapse last time as well. Truthfully, I am not sure if it was the Delphi II design, I just bought new ones from the dealership along with the cam. Did not do ADM delete.

 

[swathdiver]

I did not replace the VLOM, due to me not doing my homework before I did the job. It was an AFM lifter that did collapse last time as well. Truthfully, I am not sure if it was the Delphi II design, I just bought new ones from the dealership along with the cam. Did not do ADM delete.

The improved lifters are 12645725. The improved VLOM is 12571609. Standard lifters are 12648846. The improved rocker cover is 12642655.

You didn't say what year or engine. So what do you want to do now? Another repair with AFM or get rid of it?

 

[Skatejosh369]

The improved lifters are 12645725. The improved VLOM is 12571609. Standard lifters are 12648846. The improved rocker cover is 12642655.

You didn't say what year or engine. So what do you want to do now? Another repair with AFM or get rid of it?

Sorry, its a 2008.

More than likely, another repair, since I just did replace all lifters a few months back. I would like to program it to get rid of AFM with a reputable unit that will not cause other issues.

Thank you very much for the information! Based off your knowledge, would you guess its the VLOM since I did not replace that?

 

[swathdiver]

I don't know but could have been. Make sure you replace the left side valve cover as well with the new one.

You're going to have to take it down far enough to inspect the camshaft, why not ditch AFM completely then? If not in the budget, I get it and we'll help in getting it back together right. I would get a BlackBear tune and have them turn off AFM.

 

[Skatejosh369]

I don't know but could have been. Make sure you replace the left side valve cover as well with the new one.

You're going to have to take it down far enough to inspect the camshaft, why not ditch AFM completely then? If not in the budget, I get it and we'll help in getting it back together right. I would get a BlackBear tune and have them turn off AFM.

I was going to get rid of it the first time around, but I couldn’t find a straight answer based off research on what all was needed as far as a compiled list.

 

[swathdiver]

We can help with the list of parts this time around if you like. Just let us know your course of action.

 

[NGAneer]

Dang... my 07 is at 168k. I'm just waiting on this to happen. Dreading it and wanting to do a cam swap at the same time.

 

[LandRanger]

I was going to get rid of it the first time around, but I couldn’t find a straight answer based off research on what all was needed as far as a compiled list.

I purchased an AFM/DoD delete kit with tuning from AM Racing via Ebay for under $700, everything is included, soup to nuts including flashing the ECM to delete AFM from it. I now have 5.3 with standard lifters and cam with nothing remaining from crappy AFM. You may want to send the heads out to a machine shop and have them checked and serviced with that many miles. I would check the camshaft bearings before spending the money they may be worn or galled, that would require a complete rebuild. Carolina Motor Engines in South Carolina will do a long block rebuild for $2,300 plus shipping (around $300 for round trip).

I wish you well!

PS. You may not have a collapsed lifter, could it be the a relay under the valley pan or something electronic causing the problem. Maybe someone on the forum will know if that is possible, my number 4 cylinder exhaust lifter was the problem and it wasn't collapsed...

 

[09Magic]

Can you tell us what your cold/hot idle oil pressure is? If it's not 40'ish cold or 25-30'ish hot, there's a chance that you've got a rotting/cracked o-ring at your oil pickup tube and you're sucking air. If your oil pressure is good, etc. then I'd look at replacing the VLOM. That's what sends high pressure oil to the AFM lifters to collapse them. The AFM lifters are durable and are sort of fail-safe (e.g. they use oil pressure to collapse them - not keep them extended), but they do not react well to a lack of oil or really dirty oil.

Anyone with an AFM motor such as the 5.3L LC9, etc. needs to be changing their oil every 3,000 miles without fail. Non AFM motors can handle longer intervals.

If you're pulling your heads off already, look into a bronze bushing trunnion upgrade as well. It's cheap insurance on high-mileage engines against loosing a needle bearing on your rocker arms. Any DIY person can do them.

 

[ezstriper]

agreed with above, need to replace the oil pump and O ring(very important) and my GM guy will never do this with out replacing the VLOM as well..

 

[harbison]

Skatejosh, I have had to replace one of my replacement AFM lifters that stuck just like the originals. This last time I had an engine shop do the AFM delete on the ECM using Diablosport. Cost somewhere between $100-150. That was 24,000 miles ago. Much less cost and labor than completely changing to non-AFM lifters. While you're at it, replace the left valve cover with the newer GM design. The PCV valve is built into the valve cover and when it becomes clogged it causes a lot of oil consumption and sludge.

 

[swathdiver]

So, I am stuck trying to figure out what has caused a lifter to collapse once again on me.

What did you end up doing Josh? I read recently that it is imperative that the latest VLOM be installed as the new lifters are only likely to fail due to incorrect VLOM timing or if they spin because of a broken lifter tray.