detailing questions

[wheatswake]

so i have read about all the posts about washing, claying, polishing, and waxing and have a few questions. i have a white 08 tahoe that i plan on keeping for many yrs. it has only been washed with turtle wax "zip" i believe and i am looking to do a full detail on it. so here are some of my questions.

1. does the factory put on a wax?

2. when do you use a wax cleaner/is it needed? after wash /before claying and polishing?

3. if 1. is yes would i even need to use a wax cleaner after two years from factory? does wax wear off?

4. which process i.e. (claying,polishing,waxing) is there a risk of taking off clearcoat?

5. when does a glaze come into play or is it the same as a polish?

6. for a two yr old factory paint job what would be a recommeded process?
if polishing is necessary should i just do the light polish or med. and light?

thanks for all the other posts on detailing they have been an eye opener and very informative.

 

[ndavis0001]

is the factory paint in bad shape? i was a little confused when i read about claying a 2 year old paint job...
really no NEED to clay it. get yourself a good off the shelf concentrated wash, and a good carnuba type wax and go to town. factory: no wax. yes wax wears off. if not compounding or wetsanding, no need for a paste or polish.

 

[wheatswake]

thanks for the response . paint is not in bad shape, normal factory paint job, i just did not know. i do have some small spots on the truck that washing does not get off thats why i thought i needed to clay . not to sound stupid, can you clay small areas or do you have to do the whole truck? i do have swirl marks from improper washing and i guess no wax on the truck right now . so i will get a decent soap (thinking of some gold class). maybe clay the small stuff? maybe a light polishing for the swirl marks ? also i read that carnuba wax does not last that long, should i do a synthetic? i also do have a rough spot in the paint on the front plastic bumper, maybe wet sand that? was wondering if you treated the plastic the same as the metal.

 

[baron]

You can clay small areas. Clay is really for smoothing out the clearcoat/paint (in the case your clearcoat is gone or you had an old ride w/o one) from oxidation and the like. You can generally tell if you need it if, after a really good wash job, you run your finger over the paint and it isn't smooth. You can feel the rough spots. I bought some clay for my 07 Yukon, but I found that I didn't need it after I washed it for the first time. It was in good condition. Not that it wouldn't have helped a bit, but... After washing it, I realized how much surface area is involved. DANG. It is a lot of truck. It takes forever to wash. I ended up just washing and doing a quick wax, took about 2.5 hours and I stopped b/c the sun had gone way down. I'd say 5 hours would be a good time to invest for a proper wash + clay + wax. You want to be sure to have it as clean as possible before a clay as the clay can pick up stuff that will scratch your coating. Also, DO NOT DROP the clay on the ground. If you do, shave off that layer of clay or toss it, any little thing (like a grain of sand) will not be good! Sorry to ramble, I have more detailing info if you really need it. ha

 

[wheatswake]

thanks for some more insight . so i guess i dont need to clay. what sould i do about the light swirl marks and little spots i.e. pollen,tar marks,etc? light polish? it seems that my rear hatch has alot of spots i can see after a wash. should i use syntheic or carnuba wax? i read that carnuba does not bond or last that long. do you treat the painted plastic the same as the metal? what is a glaze? is it the same as polish?

 

[nytahoe]

http://www.glimmerglassdetailing.com/index.html
talk to rob he is a member on the site and help you with all your ?'s and he also sells very good stuff. every thing i use on my own cars and cars i deail ive gotten from him.

 

[BULLDAWG]

First what color is your ride? If its a dark color do not hand wax it. Get a small orbital polisher from sears or home depot (around an 8") and put on and take off the wax with terry cloth bonnets. It will help you not get any more swirl marks than you already have.

I clay my vehicles and seal the paint once a year and wax them every other month. My truck and suburban are both 8 years old ,actually my truck is nine, and next to a break down of the clear coat on my truck fender flares the paint looks great.

 

[Sasquatch]

+1 on talking to rob from glimmerglass. I bought a porter cable 7424xp and a bunch of pads and polishes from him. he was extremely helpful in getting me exactly what i needed. shipping is lightning fast and my yukons paint looks incredible since i used it. i only wish i had bought one sooner.

 

[Green monster]

If you have some lite swirl marks and paint is still new, I would use mothers 3 stage system. 1 precleaner, 2 sealer and 3 carnuba wax. It takes a little time but when finished the truck will look great.

 

[photoryan]

so i have read about all the posts about washing, claying, polishing, and waxing and have a few questions. i have a white 08 tahoe that i plan on keeping for many yrs. it has only been washed with turtle wax "zip" i believe and i am looking to do a full detail on it. so here are some of my questions.

1. does the factory put on a wax?

2. when do you use a wax cleaner/is it needed? after wash /before claying and polishing?

3. if 1. is yes would i even need to use a wax cleaner after two years from factory? does wax wear off?

4. which process i.e. (claying,polishing,waxing) is there a risk of taking off clearcoat?

5. when does a glaze come into play or is it the same as a polish?

6. for a two yr old factory paint job what would be a recommeded process?
if polishing is necessary should i just do the light polish or med. and light?

thanks for all the other posts on detailing they have been an eye opener and very informative.

I'm a part time detailer (and full time enthusiast), so here is what I've found through my experience (and a lot of research.)

1. Factories generally won't put on wax. A dealership might, but wax only lasts a short peiord of time, depending on use and abuse of the vehicle. (Garaged 23 hours a day will retain wax much longer than a daily driver.)

2.There is a difference between washing, polishing and cleaning. Washing just removes the dirt and grime that is sitting above the paint surface that has not bonded to the paint ("paint" referring to color coat and clearcoat). Polishing (generally the same as a glaze) will bring out the depth of the color, assuming the paint is in a condition good enough for polishing. Cleaning is what gets the paint in polishing condition. Cleaning is composed of claying, which removes bonded contaminants from the paint (overspray, rail dust, fallout, etc.) Using a paint cleaner is what will remove minor scratches, swirls and oxidation (yes oxidation cannot be removed by claying, because it is already in the clearcoat at that point.)

2.b. Wax cleaner is just a two step process combined into one step. It cleans the paint as you apply it, then it cures and you wipe off and you are left with a protective wax.

3.Yes, wax wears out. Generally, a daily driver needs to be re-waxed every 3-6 months (depending on use and abuse.)

4. Only paint cleaning will remove clear coat. But the point is to remove a verrrrrryyyyy thin layer of the clear coat to level it all out so that the entire surface looks perfectly level again. Claying will make the surface smooth, but will not remove the appearance of scratches, oxidation, etc. (Well, very aggressive clay will marr the surface of the clearcoat, requiring a paint cleaner to get rid of the marrs.)

5.See #2

6. It depends on the condition of your paint. Because your Tahoe is white, you have it a lot easier than my black beauty. If there are apparent swirls, scratches or oxidation, you need to do a paint cleaner. Depending on the severity of them, you could easily get away with a one step cleaner/polish/wax. Since I'm a hardcore Meguiars user, that is the reference that I can use off the top of my head (but you can find other similar products by other manufacuturers.) For really minor blemishes, you could use the Deep Crystal System paint cleaner. You probably don't need a polish, unless it is part of the all-in-one step. You could also use their Cleaner Wax as a one step product.

Let me know if you have other questions or need more detail about the answers here.

---------- Post added at 02:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:13 PM ----------

thanks for the response . paint is not in bad shape, normal factory paint job, i just did not know. i do have some small spots on the truck that washing does not get off thats why i thought i needed to clay . not to sound stupid, can you clay small areas or do you have to do the whole truck? i do have swirl marks from improper washing and i guess no wax on the truck right now . so i will get a decent soap (thinking of some gold class). maybe clay the small stuff? maybe a light polishing for the swirl marks ? also i read that carnuba wax does not last that long, should i do a synthetic? i also do have a rough spot in the paint on the front plastic bumper, maybe wet sand that? was wondering if you treated the plastic the same as the metal.

Yes, you can clay small areas. Just get a clay bar kit (any brand should be fine) and go according to the directions. (BTW- I saw a video that the Liquid Ice clay bar kit doesn't do much at all.)
From what I've hear, Carnuba has a lower melting point, so it generally doesn't last as long in really hot weather. Synthetic tends to last longer, but carnuba generally looks better on darker colored vehicles.
Don't wet sand, unless you really know what you're doing. You can cause SERIOUS damage to your paint that you may not be able to correct without a repaint. Do you know what the rough spot is? Is it orange peel, overspray, oxidation from bird poop or tree berries? Don't treat it like metal. Vehicle paint is much softer than metal and cannot be treated the same.

 

[ProStreetCamaro]

I'm a part time detailer (and full time enthusiast), so here is what I've found through my experience (and a lot of research.)

1. Factories generally won't put on wax. A dealership might, but wax only lasts a short peiord of time, depending on use and abuse of the vehicle. (Garaged 23 hours a day will retain wax much longer than a daily driver.)

2.There is a difference between washing, polishing and cleaning. Washing just removes the dirt and grime that is sitting above the paint surface that has not bonded to the paint ("paint" referring to color coat and clearcoat). Polishing (generally the same as a glaze) will bring out the depth of the color, assuming the paint is in a condition good enough for polishing. Cleaning is what gets the paint in polishing condition. Cleaning is composed of claying, which removes bonded contaminants from the paint (overspray, rail dust, fallout, etc.) Using a paint cleaner is what will remove minor scratches, swirls and oxidation (yes oxidation cannot be removed by claying, because it is already in the clearcoat at that point.)

2.b. Wax cleaner is just a two step process combined into one step. It cleans the paint as you apply it, then it cures and you wipe off and you are left with a protective wax.

3.Yes, wax wears out. Generally, a daily driver needs to be re-waxed every 3-6 months (depending on use and abuse.)

4. Only paint cleaning will remove clear coat. But the point is to remove a verrrrrryyyyy thin layer of the clear coat to level it all out so that the entire surface looks perfectly level again. Claying will make the surface smooth, but will not remove the appearance of scratches, oxidation, etc. (Well, very aggressive clay will marr the surface of the clearcoat, requiring a paint cleaner to get rid of the marrs.)

5.See #2

6. It depends on the condition of your paint. Because your Tahoe is white, you have it a lot easier than my black beauty. If there are apparent swirls, scratches or oxidation, you need to do a paint cleaner. Depending on the severity of them, you could easily get away with a one step cleaner/polish/wax. Since I'm a hardcore Meguiars user, that is the reference that I can use off the top of my head (but you can find other similar products by other manufacuturers.) For really minor blemishes, you could use the Deep Crystal System paint cleaner. You probably don't need a polish, unless it is part of the all-in-one step. You could also use their Cleaner Wax as a one step product.

Let me know if you have other questions or need more detail about the answers here.

---------- Post added at 02:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:13 PM ----------



Yes, you can clay small areas. Just get a clay bar kit (any brand should be fine) and go according to the directions. (BTW- I saw a video that the Liquid Ice clay bar kit doesn't do much at all.)
From what I've hear, Carnuba has a lower melting point, so it generally doesn't last as long in really hot weather. Synthetic tends to last longer, but carnuba generally looks better on darker colored vehicles.
Don't wet sand, unless you really know what you're doing. You can cause SERIOUS damage to your paint that you may not be able to correct without a repaint. Do you know what the rough spot is? Is it orange peel, overspray, oxidation from bird poop or tree berries? Don't treat it like metal. Vehicle paint is much softer than metal and cannot be treated the same.

Not knocking you, just wanted to clear this up. I see this all the time from people.

A paint cleaner does just that. Removes any old wax or residue on the paint. It does not remove any clear coat nor does it remove any swirls or scratches. Real polish has abrasives that remove swirls and scratches but real polish can only be used with a GOOD dual action polisher or a rotary with good pads like lake country pads. Most over the counter stuff is very weak and doesn't work well or last very long.

 

[wheatswake]

so what has the ability to remove clearcoat since there seems to be differing opinions? claying,polishing,paint cleaner? does the PC help prevent burning edges? when i refered to treating plactic the same as metal, i think i was misunderstood. does one detail the painted plastic the same as the painted metal?

so i am thining of washing and claying some small areas (rocker panels and complete rear hatch), and then i dont know what i want to do. i dont have money for a PC and good polish, so what OTC product(s) would ya'll recommend for polish/wax? i do have very light swirl marks and my 2008 white tahoe has only been washed, never detailed/waxed. between paint cleaner,wax cleaner,glazes,swirl remover,polish,waxes,all-in-one products it seems that there are many routes to go. any suggestions?

 

[2K6TBSS]

If you use a harsh "cleaner" wax, then you can damage the clearcoat, most OTC products will not have enough abrasives to do damage.

Yes, a PC will prevent burning the edges (damaging the clear). Do not get a rotary machine from Home Depot or somewhere like that, as they will damage the vehicle. The rotary machines only turn one way, so they will cause damage super fast (if you don't have the experience), where a PC has a random pattern that will make damage a lit harder (not going to say impossible, but...).

Yes, you would detail the painted plastics (bumpers) the same as the painted metal.

If you are going to do the OTC products, then I would suggest Meguiars, as they are probably the best OTC available. I would say to give Glimmerglass a call before buying anything OTC, I had bought many products from Chris (previous owner). They are really good at putting together a complete kit within a specific budget.

If you know anyone with a PC, I would ask to borrow it, as doing your Tahoe will kick your ass if you try and do everything by hand.

 

[BOSS]

Uhm rather than disagree with some of the posts so far I will answer the questions as best I can. It's tough, these days it seems every manufacturer calls their product a polish.

Basically to summarize paint cleaning products, they are described by their abrasiveness. Compounds are the most abrasive, while polishes or glazes are the least. As you make a decision to clean the paint, you decide how bad your paint is. Best way to do this is look at it under fluorescent (artificial) lighting and see the fine scratches (if any). You can hurt your paint with just about any product if you apply it incorrectly. You basically have only about 2 or 3 trashbags thickness of paint if you can imagine. So if you use a machine buffer, make sure you do not apply in an area too long as you will burn the paint. And if using a hard abrasive, be careful of the edges or creases in your paint as you can potentially damage those.


1. does the factory put on a wax?
Not that I'm aware of, unless your dealer does it on the lot showing the cars off as best they can

2. when do you use a wax cleaner/is it needed? after wash /before claying and polishing?

To start a good detail job:

1. Use clear-coat safe bug/tar remover to get any road grime on the fenders and wheel wells.
2. Good wash with dish-washing soap to remove any old wax.
3. Claying is first. Claying the vehicle is to remove "bonded" contaminants. That is, paint overspray or baked in bug guts etc. Anything that sticks to the paint and can't be washed off. If you can "feel" something when you rub your hand over the paint, but you can't "see" it...that's generally what clay will remove. (Use the directions provided with your clay package - I get mine at autozone.)
4. Fine Scratch remover (Choose your level of product for your specific needs - if you have an old vehicle, chances are you have alot of imperfections and might need a compound. Newer vehicles might only need a polish in step 5)
5. Polish
6. Glaze
7. Wax

3. if 1. is yes would i even need to use a wax cleaner after two years from factory? does wax wear off?
I have never bought into the cleaning and waxing in-one products personally.

Each product has a specific use.
Cleaner - removes minor blemishes, hazes and paint oxidation
Wax - puts a layer of wax on the clear to protect


So in order of most abrasive to least abrasive:
Compound - most abrasive, removes major swirls, scratches and sanding blemishes in the clear
Fine Scratch Removers - removes minor scratches (from brush washes for example)
Ultra Fine Scratch Removers - removes even more minor scratches
Polishes - very very fine abrasive to put the shine back into your clearcoat and typically does not offer any protective qualities
Glazes - gives the paint a very wet look, puts oils back into the clear - typically no protective qualities
Wax - protects the paint from the elements

Yes wax wears off - washing, sun, rain etc will wear off wax quickly. You use your vehicle, so you be the judge of how long between waxes. I do mine 2-3 times per year, and use Meguiar's Ultimate Quik Detailer 2/3 times per month.

4. which process i.e. (claying,polishing,waxing) is there a risk of taking off clearcoat?

Any abrasive cleaner removes very fine layers of clear coat. For example, a "compound" cleaner will remove substantial amounts of fine layers of clearcoat as it helps you remove fine to moderate scratches or swirls in the clear. On the other hand, a true polish has a low abrasiveness as it cleans and nourishes your clearcoat back to a shine. Glazes may have what's called filler, that is to say they have a filler that essentially hides some paint imperfections like swirls.


5. when does a glaze come into play or is it the same as a polish?
(see above)

6. for a two yr old factory paint job what would be a recommeded process?
if polishing is necessary should i just do the light polish or med. and light?

I personally would go with a clay, very fine scratch remover, polish, glaze and a wax.

B

 

[BOSS]

Oh and someone mentioned that Carnuaba wax has a low melting point, but it's really the highest of most "natural" waxes.

Melting point: 82–86 °C (180–187 °F), among the highest of natural waxes.

So if your paint gets over 187deg. F, you should probably look for some shade. A black car in the sun can get around 160-170 in hot states.

I've been using carnuaba since I was 10yrs old I think

B

 

[ckylesworld]

Uhm rather than disagree with some of the posts so far I will answer the questions as best I can. It's tough, these days it seems every manufacturer calls their product a polish.

Basically to summarize paint cleaning products, they are described by their abrasiveness. Compounds are the most abrasive, while polishes or glazes are the least. As you make a decision to clean the paint, you decide how bad your paint is. Best way to do this is look at it under fluorescent (artificial) lighting and see the fine scratches (if any). You can hurt your paint with just about any product if you apply it incorrectly. You basically have only about 2 or 3 trashbags thickness of paint if you can imagine. So if you use a machine buffer, make sure you do not apply in an area too long as you will burn the paint. And if using a hard abrasive, be careful of the edges or creases in your paint as you can potentially damage those.


1. does the factory put on a wax?
Not that I'm aware of, unless your dealer does it on the lot showing the cars off as best they can

2. when do you use a wax cleaner/is it needed? after wash /before claying and polishing?

To start a good detail job:

1. Use clear-coat safe bug/tar remover to get any road grime on the fenders and wheel wells.
2. Good wash with dish-washing soap to remove any old wax.
3. Claying is first. Claying the vehicle is to remove "bonded" contaminants. That is, paint overspray or baked in bug guts etc. Anything that sticks to the paint and can't be washed off. If you can "feel" something when you rub your hand over the paint, but you can't "see" it...that's generally what clay will remove. (Use the directions provided with your clay package - I get mine at autozone.)
4. Fine Scratch remover (Choose your level of product for your specific needs - if you have an old vehicle, chances are you have alot of imperfections and might need a compound. Newer vehicles might only need a polish in step 5)
5. Polish
6. Glaze
7. Wax

3. if 1. is yes would i even need to use a wax cleaner after two years from factory? does wax wear off?
I have never bought into the cleaning and waxing in-one products personally.

Each product has a specific use.
Cleaner - removes minor blemishes, hazes and paint oxidation
Wax - puts a layer of wax on the clear to protect


So in order of most abrasive to least abrasive:
Compound - most abrasive, removes major swirls, scratches and sanding blemishes in the clear
Fine Scratch Removers - removes minor scratches (from brush washes for example)
Ultra Fine Scratch Removers - removes even more minor scratches
Polishes - very very fine abrasive to put the shine back into your clearcoat and typically does not offer any protective qualities
Glazes - gives the paint a very wet look, puts oils back into the clear - typically no protective qualities
Wax - protects the paint from the elements

Yes wax wears off - washing, sun, rain etc will wear off wax quickly. You use your vehicle, so you be the judge of how long between waxes. I do mine 2-3 times per year, and use Meguiar's Ultimate Quik Detailer 2/3 times per month.

4. which process i.e. (claying,polishing,waxing) is there a risk of taking off clearcoat?

Any abrasive cleaner removes very fine layers of clear coat. For example, a "compound" cleaner will remove substantial amounts of fine layers of clearcoat as it helps you remove fine to moderate scratches or swirls in the clear. On the other hand, a true polish has a low abrasiveness as it cleans and nourishes your clearcoat back to a shine. Glazes may have what's called filler, that is to say they have a filler that essentially hides some paint imperfections like swirls.


5. when does a glaze come into play or is it the same as a polish?
(see above)

6. for a two yr old factory paint job what would be a recommeded process?
if polishing is necessary should i just do the light polish or med. and light?

I personally would go with a clay, very fine scratch remover, polish, glaze and a wax.

B

+1 on all of that.I have been using meguiars EVERYTHING and love it. They have a forum that has everything you need to know from washing to a complete makeover. Just go to meguiars.com and click on forum. It has really helped me know what and how to do things.

 

[2drhoeon4s]

no need for glaze if you are compounding... glaze is like wax but it is more of a filler. if you do the compounding right then you wont need a glaze.