New member with unknown drop on 05 Denali

[spooledup91DSM]

We just purchased an 05 Denali for my wife. We kinda got burned on it and after we learned of the vehicles history, we realize we're stuck with it. Knowing that, we're prepared to dump the money in it to return it to a fully functioning luxury vehicle. Although I will not be performing most of the work, I am a mechanic and I'm VERY familiar with the ins and outs of GM vehicles so please don't dumb things down for me.
Now, first issue, as you can see, the vehicle has been dropped. The rear has some blue springs is all I know about them. They did not use shock extenders or anything. The front appears to be dropped by the torsion bars since the front tires have obvious negative camber. We want the factory Z55 suspension to perform properly so we realize the drop has to go. No biggie. I've included pics so someone might be able to tell me how low the drop is. Because one thing I've never messed with are torsion bars. How will my guy know how much either way to get the front end back to factory height?

 

[NathanJax]

Looks like a lot. maybe a 3/5 even. Does it have OEM front spindles or do they say Belltech or McGauphy on them?

How many miles on the truck?

On the drivers rear corner, do you see the air compressor? Going back with OEM shocks, struts and possibly fixing the air pump could be $1,000+ when you could go with a great aftermarket (non air ride) setup for half that.

Are you keeping OEM wheels/tires?

 

[Bomba02]

looks good, haha. does it not ride good? It deff looks like its more then just keys.

 

[Yngbld32]

Where you located at?

 

[spooledup91DSM]

Yngbld, I am located in WV. We purchased the vehicle in Indianapolis.
Well, we kinda like the stance but it rides terrible! The rearend is basically held up by the springs. They left the factory shocks on it without even using extenders so now the shocks are blown all to hell. Same thing on the front; factory shocks and it constantly hits the bump stops.
Here's the deal, I would keep it where it's at because for our area, it's very unique because NO ONE has any lowered GMT800's (is that the right term?). The body style before ours? Yes, a few but I haven't seen any like ours lowered. For me to leave it lowered, this is what I require:
1. We must be able to retain at least the ELC in the rear just in case we load up with in-laws and go somewhere. I don't want it to sag whatsoever when there's a load in the rear.
2. Our roads are still a mess from last winter with ****** patch jobs everywhere. It's a luxury vehicle and I want the ride to be like a domestic luxury vehicle over these type of roads. But, myself, I like to rip it up a lil on our twisty mountain roads so I could use a suspension that can do both (I realize the factory setup isn't the sportiest with its high center).
So if there's not an aftermarket setup for the same price as returning to a brand new factory setup, we're gonna have to raise it back up. I hope I was kinda clear on what I'd like to have IF we can keep its current stance.
Where would I find an aftermarket name on the spindles? Also, if it's dropped on spindles, why does it have such bad negative camber? Thanks for trying to help me figure this out, guys.

---------- Post added at 09:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:03 PM ----------

Oh, it has 100k miles on it and we're not doing wheels until spring because we're about to drop probably $2500 into this thing to get it back to where it should be. It has some issues but nothing too serious I guess. But I figure all together with the suspension issues, when all is said and done, we're gonna be dropping around that $2500 number. Like I said, we got burned a lil and know we're stuck with it because of its history.
When we do wheels, I'm looking to do 20's in a satin black multi-spoked wheel.

---------- Post added at 10:52 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:08 PM ----------

Ok, so if I redo the suspension with this kit, if I understand correctly, I can still use the auto leveling shocks, correct? What about the front shocks? Does the kit still allow the Z55 system to work properly? If not, is my only option the Arnott shocks with the resistor? I don't want the service ride control message on, lol. What about the stability system? Is there a way to drop it, retain the auto level and stability system? I just don't know what way to go. Like, I have no friggin idea! Help! Please! Lol

 

[M Hankel]

Kinda sounds like it was dropped all wrong. A properly dropped rig will ride very nice. I get compliments on my ride quality all the time so it is possible to get a nice ride while being lowered.

It sounds like It's got lowering keys in the front and I'd be willing to bet the rear still has the factory bump stop attached to the frame. If so, it will bottom out easily and ride like crap. Research the "free travel mod" if you want to stay low and have a good ride.

There's a sticky at the top of this section that has different drops and short descriptions of ride impressions etc. These rigs will never corner like a sports car but they can be much better than they were from the factory while still having a decent ride.

Mike

ps Nice little DSM in the background. I'm assuming that is another toy. I had 92 6/4 bolt Talon about 10 years ago. It had a big 16G, 3" downtube, 3" catback, ARP head studs, Apexi Tuner, MBC, larger injectors etc. Pretty quick and fun little car (when it ran) but it was my daily driver and I got tired of it nickel/diming me to death... It was always something with that thing.

 

[spooledup91DSM]

Yea, I just traded my 02 Deville for that car. It's not too bad. Body's solid, no rust to speak of anywhere. Its a 91 TSi AWD and ive been wanting a 1ga for awhile. even has the leather seats which I pretty much can't live without in a vehicle. has a piston beat all to hell from a dropped valve. I'm throwing another engine together for it to have it going for winter. Engine is just a stock short block but I'm redoing a nice had for it. It's got BC springs and Comp Cams 101100 and 101200 cams. Should match the EvoIII 16g and stock intake manifold quite well. Full 3in exhaust with a header. Probably gonna shoot for 27psi outta the 16g. Maybe a lb or two more. For tuning, we use Jackal native speed density and the Moats Ostrich and I prefer the LC1 WB. No crappy old maf sensor with this setup and a mere fraction of the cost of ECMlink.
This is actually my second DSM. First one was a non turbo 92 Talon that I converted to turbo with a built bottom end with 272 Web Cams.
Yea, when a DSM is running, smart opponents put on their game face cause most know it's easy to get smacked in the mouth if they underestimate the mighty 4G63!
Yes, the drop on our Denali is your typical gimp job. I'm gonna start a new thread with questions on the various companies and what I'm looking for with the rebuilding of this hack job suspension.

 

[M Hankel]

Yeah they're fun cars for sure. I learned a ton about tuning a turbo car even though the options were very limited with the tuner I was using. I bought the car to learn with because it was cheap and already had most of the mods on it. Ended up porting the wastegate myself because it kept getting boost creep in 3rd-5th gears. That helped a ton with the creep though. Fun little car but the reliability just wasn't there for a DD. I ended up dumping the car for way more than I paid for it and by then, 2nd gear was grinding like crazy.

Wow, 27 psi out of a 16g? That seems like it would be way out of its efficiency range. I thought those were only good to 22 or so? Keep a close eye on your IAT's unless you're running a meth injection or something lol...

Mike

 

[spooledup91DSM]

Idk, I've wondered that but there seems to be a lot of people running those lil turbos up in that range. Realistically, I'll probably be running 25lbs just for the reason you mentioned; IAT's. Last thing I want is a meth dependent car. It's just not cost effective on such a small turbo, not to mention, this combo isn't too awful far from stock. Let's face it, with what I mentioned, it's a very tame setup that's been done over and over and over again. These cars have reached cookie cutter build status.

Ok, so back to the Denali. I got my head under it as far as I could (actually, I can't get my head under the damn thing) and looked around to see what goin on in the front. We already know that it's got drop springs with busted factory shocks out back. The front is completely stock. Spindles, control arms, and all that jazz. Now that I understand how the torsion bars and keys work (even with my automotive back ground, I didn't fully understand them until this forum. Just the pics of parts was all I needed) I looked where the key bolts are and while I can't tell what keys are on it, it's obvious where some of, if not all of the front drop comes from. The bolts are backed out so that on the drivers side, from where the threads enter the hole, to the top of the bolt head is at least a full inch. On the passenger side, I didn't even move to that side because I could tell from where I was that the bolt on the passenger side is actually backed out farther than the one on the drivers side. My question? Is it possible to drop the front end that friggin low, on stock keys, by cranking those bolts out that far? I ask because I'm going with the Mcgaughy 2/3 deluxe kit with the spindles and need to know if I need to track down stock keys to get the proper height of the kit. So let's say the truck currently has 3/4 ton keys, it will be lower than the kits advertised drop of 2in, correct? If so, I'll need those stock keys.

PS: My wife admitted she doesn't really want it to stay as low as it is. We agreed on the 2/3 drop is why I'm now diverting from fixing the issues with its current stance. Just wanted to clear that up.

 

[01ssreda4]

Couple of things. No way they took stock keys that far, there isn't enough adjusting room and even if there was you'd have more tire lean. Second, it seems as if they have the keys done and THEN they still went to far (going for level height no doubt). But, to me the negative camber looks like complete poo. So they took a 1 1/2"-2" key drop and turned it into a 3+ by going too far with it. Should be a simple fix by cranking them back up and getting a fresh alignment (or go equal turns on both sides to get you by). The problem then will be the front may look a little too high for the rear. If that was the case I would try to bring the rear up some to the desired look.

 

[spooledup91DSM]

Couple of things. No way they took stock keys that far, there isn't enough adjusting room and even if there was you'd have more tire lean. Second, it seems as if they have the keys done and THEN they still went to far (going for level height no doubt). But, to me the negative camber looks like complete poo. So they took a 1 1/2"-2" key drop and turned it into a 3+ by going too far with it. Should be a simple fix by cranking them back up and getting a fresh alignment (or go equal turns on both sides to get you by). The problem then will be the front may look a little too high for the rear. If that was the case I would try to bring the rear up some to the desired look.

Alright! I know everything I need to know, guys. Not just with the replies here but researching the various threads.
Knowing what I do now, I know what my course of action will be. I do still have some questions regarding various parts and/or the combination of parts. I will start another thread on that after researching the various vendors. Thank you, TYF.

 

[NORCAL SS]

with as much camber as it has in front on that pic its keys decranked

if ride is bad just crank up front keys as a start.
in rear blue springs were the djm older ones.


What do you want to do with the truck just bring it up??? or keep it at same level and ride better? Tell me what you want as end goal and I can help you dial it in.

 

[spooledup91DSM]

with as much camber as it has in front on that pic its keys decranked

if ride is bad just crank up front keys as a start.
in rear blue springs were the djm older ones.


What do you want to do with the truck just bring it up??? or keep it at same level and ride better? Tell me what you want as end goal and I can help you dial it in.

Yes, my wife wants it raised up a lil bit from its current stance, so we're looking for the end result to be a 2/3-4 drop while retaining the ELC system.
What shocks would you recommend for the front end to give me the best balance of comfort and handling? Same with the rear. What shocks would you recommend to best match the front shocks? Sway bars will be upgraded as well to help control body roll.
I have another question about a setup like this. If we're fooling the autoride system into thinking it's still controlling the dampening of the shocks, will the stability system still function properly?

 

[7SubTrooper]

I hope you get it straightened out it looks like a nice rig. The stance looks nice but that front angle looks bad.

 

[NORCAL SS]

Yes, my wife wants it raised up a lil bit from its current stance, so we're looking for the end result to be a 2/3-4 drop while retaining the ELC system.
What shocks would you recommend for the front end to give me the best balance of comfort and handling? Same with the rear. What shocks would you recommend to best match the front shocks? Sway bars will be upgraded as well to help control body roll.
I have another question about a setup like this. If we're fooling the autoride system into thinking it's still controlling the dampening of the shocks, will the stability system still function properly?

if your using keys in front no matter what you do more then 1 inch drop wont ride well. this is why i do the djm a arms and belltech sp shocks. Adjustable 2-3 inches and a much better ride plus new bushings and balljoints.


does your autoride work and do you want to keep it or dont mind bypassing it?

I hav ea custom 3/5-6 kit that rides excellent since i speced the rear springs heres something to read
http://www.tahoeyukonforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49997

 

[Young28]

not that it matters but iirc ground force had blue springs as well.

 

[NORCAL SS]

not that it matters but iirc ground force had blue springs as well.

yes but tey didnt sit that low

 

[spooledup91DSM]

No matter, fellas. It's well under control! Just ordered a 2/4 kit with spindles, and extenders, and on top of that, I also ordered Arnotts re-man OEM rear shocks, new Arnott air compressor (we'll see how it lasts) and Eibach swaybars. Oh, as for the torsion bar keys, it doesn't matter what kinda shit they threw on it, brand new GM keys are waiting for it. Now, as for the front shocks, we're gonna see how they do; same for tierods, etc.
Now for the rest of the shit we need...we're hemorrhaging $100's but we knew the night we got it home what we were in store for. I mentioned how we were burned on this purchase. Not only was the suspension gimped, after running the vin, we discovered the reason for the reconstructed title; it's a flood vehicle. New York, 2012. But like I said, after having the Tech II hooked up, electrically, it's not that bad. So, we're just going through the entire thing and fixing/replacing anything that's wrong until every single thing operates as it did when it left the dealer, if not better. Thank you everyone for your time.

 

[NORCAL SS]

which 2/4 kit did you get?

did you get the djm endlinks and new bumpstops needed when going with 4 inch drop in rear to fix swaybar angle? also the bumpstops your cutting off for free travel mod so need new bumpstops

 

[spooledup91DSM]

which 2/4 kit did you get?

did you get the djm endlinks and new bumpstops needed when going with 4 inch drop in rear to fix swaybar angle? also the bumpstops your cutting off for free travel mod so need new bumpstops

Hmmm...you, sir, have a PM