Fuel additives

[CapnBob]

Hey guys
I have been adding a bottle
Of Lucas injector cleaner
Every other fill up.
Am I doing it too much?
Is it good or bad?
Thanks for advice.
Just trying to take good care of
My truck.

 

[B-train]

I think you may be a little overzealous on the frequency. LOL . But, being on a proactive schedule isn't a bad thing, maybe more like every 10k would be my thoughts if you feel it's needed.

In my personal experience, I've used injector cleaner probably 10 times on all the vehicles I've owned. Never really saw the need for more. I used to add 1/2 quart of ATF to the tank every 6 months (approx 20k miles or so) years back when injectors were more prone to getting sticky from Ethanol fuels and it worked wonders for a fraction of the cost.

Depending on what year your vehicle is, there are other things I'd find more pressing than injector cleaner. Most fuels nowadays are just fine and the materials used don't seem to be negatively affected like they used to be. If you have a 2015, or newer, with direct injection I'd be more worried about keeping carbon buildup off the valves.

 

[CapnBob]

Thanks for your reply!
Any advice on how to keep
Carbon of the valves?
I’m an old man and this has
To be my last truck
Thanks

 

[Walkerfever]

Thanks for your reply!
Any advice on how to keep
Carbon of the valves?
I’m an old man and this has
To be my last truck
Thanks

All the junk from the PCV system is routed through the intake runners and intake valves. In a port injection engine this is no big deal since gasoline is a cleaner and is sprayed into the intake runners\onto the intake valves. On direct injected engines, the gas is injected directly into the combustion chamber so it never gets a chance to clean the intake runners or valves. Add a catch can to to the PCV system to "filter" out this crud, and empty the catch can when needed.

Depending on how many miles you have, you might want to get the intake valves cleaned. You can do it yourself (I did with walnut blasting) or pay someone to do it.

 

[Fless]

All the junk from the PCV system is routed through the intake runners and intake valves. In a port injection engine this is no big deal since gasoline is a cleaner and is sprayed into the intake runners\onto the intake valves. On direct injected engines, the gas is injected directly into the combustion chamber so it never gets a chance to clean the intake runners or valves. Add a catch can to to the PCV system to "filter" out this crud, and empty the catch can when needed.

Depending on how many miles you have, you might want to get the intake valves cleaned. You can do it yourself (I did with walnut blasting) or pay someone to do it.

^^^ THIS.

 

[B-train]

Thanks for your reply!
Any advice on how to keep
Carbon of the valves?
I’m an old man and this has
To be my last truck
Thanks

There is a sea foam product that you spray into the intake while running at 1200 rpm for about 7 minutes. Then let it soak for 30, then drive "spirited" for 15 minutes or so.

This basically coats all the intake valves in a potent cleaner that dissolves the carbon buildup. Driving semi-aggressively then helps remove the loosened up stuff. There is also an aerosol GM TOO ENGINE CLEANER that works well too. No engine disassembly required.

 

[homesick]

I put a can of Seafoam in each tank of gas. My mechanic thinks it's a waste.

joe

 

[Stbentoak]

I put a can of Seafoam in each tank of gas. My mechanic thinks it's a waste.

joe

He's right....If there are no other problems once a year is plenty.

 

[Marky Dissod]

Hey guys, I've been adding a bottle of Lucas injector cleaner every other fill up. Am I doing it too much? Is it good or bad? Thanks for advice.
Just trying to take good care of my truck.

Red Line SI-1 Complete Fuel System Cleaner
Chevron Techron Concentrate Plus 01154100-5179P
Gumout Regane High Mileage Fuel System Cleaner
Gumout Regane Complete Fuel System Cleaner
Gumout All-In-One Complete Fuel System Cleaner
Lucas Oil 10512 Deep Clean Fuel System Cleaner
LubeGard Fuel System Booster

They all contain reasonable amounts of poly ether amines.
Other fuel additives do not brag about PEAs, but may still be effective.
Please note that instead of stopping at a brand name, the specific version of cleaner is also included.

 

[homesick]

He's right....If there are no other problems once a year is plenty.

My Escalade often sits for weeks at a time, and I've seen the damage watery corn gas can do.

It may not help much, but I consider it cheap insurance.

joe

 

[Rygrego]

Thanks for your reply!
Any advice on how to keep
Carbon of the valves?
I’m an old man and this has
To be my last truck
Thanks

I remove the line from the pcv valve and with the engine running spray a full can of CRC Intake Cleaner through the hose until empty then let it heat soak for about an hour then go out find an open road and drive it like you stole it. Every year or so and you'll have no problems.

 

[CMoore711]

I remove the line from the pcv valve and with the engine running spray a full can of CRC Intake Cleaner through the hose until empty then let it heat soak for about an hour then go out find an open road and drive it like you stole it. Every year or so and you'll have no problems.

Depending on vehicle age and mileage any harm in doing something like this if you’ve never done it before?

Say 8-10 yr old vehicle 100K+ miles?

(Asking for a friend…)

 

[jfoj]

With the newer DI gasoline engines, there are a few things you should be doing.

From a good authority, this is what I have been advised.

1. Use a Top Tier fuel with a good amount of detergents. Then in addition to this you should probably be running something like the Techron Fuel Additive (or something that has similar ingredents) every 4th fill up. The DI injectors are in a far more harsh environment and are subject to carbon and fuel deposit buildup due to the heat and pressures the injectors are subjected to. Buildup on the injectors can and will impact the fuel delivery and spray pattern on DI engines, this leads to all sorts of issues in the long term. On older port fuel injection engines, this was not nearly as much of an issue.

2. On moden DI engines, highly suggest running a catch can. This will help reduce, but may not eliminate carbon build up on the back of the intake valves. There are a number quality catch cans available from vendors such as JL and K&N for typically around $150 and others are available even cheaper, but often you can get the system with the correct length hoses with quick connects and mouting brackets to make the installaton quick and easy. Worth the small investment IMHO. Just remember to check the catch can at least every 1000-1500 miles until you get a feel for how often is needs to be emptied.

3. Check your engine oil level every few fill ups, especially in the colder weather as fuel diluction can and will cause higher oil consumption. If you remote start your engine, or want to allow it to idle and warm up, be forwarned, this can cause a much higher amount of fuel to contaminate the engine oil as compared to starting the engine and driving the vehicle.

4. Change your oil when your OLM hits 25% or earlier, stretching out the oil change interveal in modern DI engines is not a wise idea. Whom ever came up with the 15,000 mile oils and filters is really screwing anyone that follows this lead. If you plan on running oil this long, get an oil sampler to pull oil for anaysis, but when the oil analysis is close to $40, you might as well just change the oil and filter, it is not much more than oil anaylsis if if you perform your own oil changes and shop around for sales and deals on oil and filters.

 

[B-train]

Depending on vehicle age and mileage any harm in doing something like this if you’ve never done it before?

Say 8-10 yr old vehicle 100K+ miles?

(Asking for a friend…)

I have a mixed review on this one from experience. I've done the seafoam dissolving treatment a few times now ans the last time was after a good stretch of miles on my 2017. I did get some rough running and misfires after the 30 minute heat soak when driven "spirirtedly." I attributed it to small pieces of carbon holding the valve partially open as chunks broke off and got processed........almost needed new underwear after that one.

That being said, I'm still a fan of it, but I wish there was a way to just hook something up and drive for an extended highway cruise that would dissolve it and eat it as it goes, not cause chunks to crumble off. Walnut blasting sounds awesome.......but not the pulling the heads part.

 

[Donf]

I remember when you could buy a "water injection system" waaaaaay back when cars had carbureted engines. Really just delivered water througha vacuum port on the intake manifold. Buddy of mine had a Winnebago with over 100,000 mile on it when he installed it. Thing slowly ran worse and worse over hundreds of mile until it just would run with enough power to barely propel the beast down the highway. Took it to a nearby RV dealer/service center. When the wrench saw the water system he explained that those vehiles had carbon build up problems and that he'd clogged his muffler with 10 years of carbon build up, replace the muffler and all was good. Being a young guy at the time I just held the throttle open on a 427 of mine that had a sticky float for some time and trickled several gallons of water down the carb. It may have run a bit better or not. But, I have never repeated that stunt.

Before I hit the "Post Reply" button I thought I ought to Google this water injection thing because nobody's going to believe that anybody would do that. Turns out, lots of people did it years ago and, apparently for good reason. I am including one link below that is both semi-educational and slightly entertaining. (But doing what I did is apparently not done by anyone with 1/2 a brain although my wife tells me that I would be qualified in doing it.........)

Vintage Water Injection - The Stovebolt Forum

www.stovebolt.com

 

[jfoj]

Donf,

Water injection is nothing new. Used on airplanes in WWII, Oldmobile had water injection standard on its 1962 turbo charged aluminum block V8 Jetfire. Many even adapted water injection to run on windshield wiper fluid (mixture of water & methanol).

As you did on your 427, some even drizzled water in the carburetor to try and rid the combustion chambers of carbon, but you had to be careful as liquids are non compressible.

The problem today is the back of the intake valves can become carboned up and water or even other hydrocarbon based products do not magically make the carbon disappear.

 

[homesick]

My Escalade often sits for weeks at a time, and I've seen the damage watery corn gas can do.

It may not help much, but I consider it cheap insurance.

joe

Seafoam's like my lucky rabbit's foot.

joe

 

[Fless]

I'm sure most of us have seen pics of the valves on DI engines, but "the cleaning guy" (Jim) in the video below shows some dirty ones. See the first couple minutes of the vid to see the carbon, and a little later (at about 12:00) he'll show the heads after they've been cleaned and glassbead blasted.

 

[PPV_2018]

My Escalade often sits for weeks at a time, and I've seen the damage watery corn gas can do.

It may not help much, but I consider it cheap insurance.

joe

I have heard that keeping the tank full when sitting for extended periods of time reduces the condensation from ethanol fuel

 

[B-train]

I remember when you could buy a "water injection system" waaaaaay back when cars had carbureted engines. Really just delivered water througha vacuum port on the intake manifold. Buddy of mine had a Winnebago with over 100,000 mile on it when he installed it. Thing slowly ran worse and worse over hundreds of mile until it just would run with enough power to barely propel the beast down the highway. Took it to a nearby RV dealer/service center. When the wrench saw the water system he explained that those vehiles had carbon build up problems and that he'd clogged his muffler with 10 years of carbon build up, replace the muffler and all was good. Being a young guy at the time I just held the throttle open on a 427 of mine that had a sticky float for some time and trickled several gallons of water down the carb. It may have run a bit better or not. But, I have never repeated that stunt.

Before I hit the "Post Reply" button I thought I ought to Google this water injection thing because nobody's going to believe that anybody would do that. Turns out, lots of people did it years ago and, apparently for good reason. I am including one link below that is both semi-educational and slightly entertaining. (But doing what I did is apparently not done by anyone with 1/2 a brain although my wife tells me that I would be qualified in doing it.........)

Vintage Water Injection - The Stovebolt Forum

www.stovebolt.com

Yes, water injection will work wonders on cleaning an engine. The instant transformation from water to steam explodes any carbon buildup. My dad mentioned doing that back in the 70's and 80's to clean out carbon buildup on old cadillacs that were just putted around and short-tripped every day of their life. Water treatment, then drive it like you stole it...... afterwards he said they would purr like kittens again.

I've wanted to rig up systems throughout the years, but you need very good controls, and a fine spray, low flow, injector of some sort. Or a very dependable venturi type system that would self regulate.

When I worked at BRP developing 300HP 2-Stroke outboard I came up with a water injection system that they actually integrated into certain models. With the wet exhaust and 2 stroke characteristics, it changed the exhaust tuning to the point it would make as much torque as a duramax of the era. It was pretty cool.