09 Yukon 6L80 TC shudder every 20k miles

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olliec420

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At 168k trans let loose and had it rebuilt at a local trans shop with good rep. Afterwards there was some hard jerking decelerating, I took it back they did some tune and it was good. Then about 20k later I got rumble strip effect and they replaced the torque converter and did some more tuning and the thing was absolutely perfect. Like new. Until last thursday, got on a new bridge here and big rumble strip effect. I know it wasnt the road because the bridge is new and smooth as glass. Ok so after rebuild the TC sucked and was replaced, why would it get messed up again? Im not driving hard, its an old girl with 198k on it now. I do drive a lot but not pulling anything and mostly highway and I'm in FL so the terrain is flat. Has anyone had a similar recurring problem?
 

Joseph Garcia

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I cannot personally assist you with your issue, but other members of this Forum much more knowledgeable than me in this area will chime in.
 
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olliec420

olliec420

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I cannot personally assist you with your issue, but other members of this Forum much more knowledgeable than me in this area will chime in.
Thanks. It seems like too many failures. Can something be wrong or out of balance or alignment or something... to cause a TC to fail? Very strange.
 

Coolman1987us

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Thanks. It seems like too many failures. Can something be wrong or out of balance or alignment or something... to cause a TC to fail? Very strange.
I'm new to the 6l80 but from what Ive read so far rumble strip is the torque converter slipping. A good tuner may be able to fix it with just a tune. I would find another mechanic. Just because they have been "rebuilding transmissions for 30 years" doesn't mean they know what they are doing.
 
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olliec420

olliec420

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I'm new to the 6l80 but from what Ive read so far rumble strip is the torque converter slipping. A good tuner may be able to fix it with just a tune. I would find another mechanic. Just because they have been "rebuilding transmissions for 30 years" doesn't mean they know what they are doing.
Nah they do the sheriffs and police dept tahoes. They know the 6L80. And the warranty is covering the 2 times I've been back in there. Not paying someone new when I have a warranty. Slipping would indicate pressure to me, no? And it was PERFECT since they had it last and 20-25 miles later, here we go again. That many bad TCs in a row? I know they'll fix but I want to know how these could be getting damaged.
 

mikez71

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@NickTransmissions can tell you!

I have heard mention of the pressure regulator wearing out causing pressure spikes taking out the converter.

Nick can tell you forsure!
 

NickTransmissions

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Nah they do the sheriffs and police dept tahoes. They know the 6L80. And the warranty is covering the 2 times I've been back in there. Not paying someone new when I have a warranty. Slipping would indicate pressure to me, no? And it was PERFECT since they had it last and 20-25 miles later, here we go again. That many bad TCs in a row? I know they'll fix but I want to know how these could be getting damaged.
Find out what or who's torque converters your builder is using and perhaps recommend they make a change if buying from one large TC reman company or another...

If the TC is a factory-level replacement, that by itself would explain what's happening and why as the JMBX converters are notorious for failing early and often. Other things can be excessive wear in the pressure regulator valve in the lower valve body, TCC limit valve, TCC apply valve, weak TCC solenoid in the TEHCM, etc...

Yea, I'm sure they'll fix it (again) but if you were bringing the transmission to me for the first time, I'd do the following:

- Fully bench test the TEHCM for electrical and mechanical function
- Fully disassemble, clean and reassemble then vacuum test both valve body assemblies (upper and lower)
- Fully disassemble, clean and reassemble then vacuum test the stator support valve trains, including the pressure regulator/boost circuits, TCC apply and TCC limit
- Visually/physically inspect the pump, VB mating surfaces, spacer plate, check ball condition, etc
- Cut the torque converter open and see how thick the converter clutch is

Once I was done and still didn't have a positively identified smoking gun, I'd start looking at other parts/systems on your vehicle like your flex plate, engine, driveline, suspension, rear transmission mount, etc....
 
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olliec420

olliec420

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Find out what or who's torque converters your builder is using and perhaps recommend they make a change if buying from one large TC reman company or another...

If the TC is a factory-level replacement, that by itself would explain what's happening and why as the JMBX converters are notorious for failing early and often. Other things can be excessive wear in the pressure regulator valve in the lower valve body, TCC limit valve, TCC apply valve, weak TCC solenoid in the TEHCM, etc...

Yea, I'm sure they'll fix it (again) but if you were bringing the transmission to me for the first time, I'd do the following:

- Fully bench test the TEHCM for electrical and mechanical function
- Fully disassemble, clean and reassemble then vacuum test both valve body assemblies (upper and lower)
- Fully disassemble, clean and reassemble then vacuum test the stator support valve trains, including the pressure regulator/boost circuits, TCC apply and TCC limit
- Visually/physically inspect the pump, VB mating surfaces, spacer plate, check ball condition, etc
- Cut the torque converter open and see how thick the converter clutch is

Once I was done and still didn't have a positively identified smoking gun, I'd start looking at other parts/systems on your vehicle like your flex plate, engine, driveline, suspension, rear transmission mount, etc....
Thanks for the detailed reply!! I sure wish I could do this myself. I definitely dont want to go in there and tell him what to do but this is helpful for me to know whats going on. So I do know they have (after the rebuild) replaced the TECHM when I brought it in for the hard downshifts. They have it 3-4 times now so hopefully they woulda have seen anything on the driveline that could cause problems but like I said, for a 200k mile truck it was working so well until last thursday. Again thanks, I will update after I take it in.
 

NickTransmissions

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Thanks for the detailed reply!! I sure wish I could do this myself. I definitely dont want to go in there and tell him what to do but this is helpful for me to know whats going on. So I do know they have (after the rebuild) replaced the TECHM when I brought it in for the hard downshifts. They have it 3-4 times now so hopefully they woulda have seen anything on the driveline that could cause problems but like I said, for a 200k mile truck it was working so well until last thursday. Again thanks, I will update after I take it in.
You're welcome...I'd also want to know if they vac tested the pump and valve body, installed a hydraulic correction kit like the Transgo Repro or Sonnax Zip kit as either are good to go for restoring like 95% of those valve bodies / pump cover valve trains to serviceability. My guess is they're using a crappy torque converter but could obviously be wrong.
 
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olliec420

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You're welcome...I'd also want to know if they vac tested the pump and valve body, installed a hydraulic correction kit like the Transgo Repro or Sonnax Zip kit as either are good to go for restoring like 95% of those valve bodies / pump cover valve trains to serviceability. My guess is they're using a crappy torque converter but could obviously be wrong.
Oh one more question... before I had it replaced I noticed that sometimes when on the interstate in cruise, cruise would just turn off randomly sometimes. That happened again for the first time in a while couple days before the rumble strip effect. Would a TC slip cause cruise control to turn off in that model?
 

NickTransmissions

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Oh one more question... before I had it replaced I noticed that sometimes when on the interstate in cruise, cruise would just turn off randomly sometimes. That happened again for the first time in a while couple days before the rumble strip effect. Would a TC slip cause cruise control to turn off in that model?
Just a guess but probably...If the engine speed delta is high enough, cruise control may kick off...Will let others who know more about the cruise control systems in these trucks weigh in...
 
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olliec420

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The engine speed doesn't jump, or if it does its not noticeable. Just cruising listening to the radio, looking out at flat FL terrain and I see the CC light go off on the dash and feel the CC disengage. I never thought of why until it hadn't happened again until now. No biggy though. Driving around town all day today since it shuddered last thursday and all is well so far. Will keep an eye on it. Will wait to take it in until I'm positive they can recreate the issue. Will keep updating.
 

NickTransmissions

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The engine speed doesn't jump, or if it does its not noticeable. Just cruising listening to the radio, looking out at flat FL terrain and I see the CC light go off on the dash and feel the CC disengage. I never thought of why until it hadn't happened again until now. No biggy though. Driving around town all day today since it shuddered last thursday and all is well so far. Will keep an eye on it. Will wait to take it in until I'm positive they can recreate the issue. Will keep updating.
If the torque converter clutch is disengaging when you're in high gear cruise control, your engine speed is increasing - take my word for it...Whether it shows up on your tach is another matter...But any systems monitoring engine performance and activity for their own inputs/outputs, such as the cruise control system, will see it. if you were to plug in a bidirectional scan tool, bring up TCC and transmission live data then drive it, you'd see TCC slip speeds far beyond 10 RPM which is considered the max acceptable for a Converter Clutch that's fully applied (i.e. TCC duty cycle is at or near the preprogrammed maximum). I believe it takes two or three consecutive drive cycles for the TCC to slip before a DTC sets and stores...
 

Coolman1987us

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The engine speed doesn't jump, or if it does its not noticeable. Just cruising listening to the radio, looking out at flat FL terrain and I see the CC light go off on the dash and feel the CC disengage. I never thought of why until it hadn't happened again until now. No biggy though. Driving around town all day today since it shuddered last thursday and all is well so far. Will keep an eye on it. Will wait to take it in until I'm positive they can recreate the issue. Will keep updating.
just for ***** and gigs change your brake light switch on the pedal. if that switch is starting to fail it will screw around with the cruise.
 

Coolman1987us

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If the torque converter clutch is disengaging when you're in high gear cruise control, your engine speed is increasing - take my word for it...Whether it shows up on your tach is another matter...But any systems monitoring engine performance and activity for their own inputs/outputs, such as the cruise control system, will see it. if you were to plug in a bidirectional scan tool, bring up TCC and transmission live data then drive it, you'd see TCC slip speeds far beyond 10 RPM which is considered the max acceptable for a Converter Clutch that's fully applied (i.e. TCC duty cycle is at or near the preprogrammed maximum). I believe it takes two or three consecutive drive cycles for the TCC to slip before a DTC sets and stores...
10 RPM? holy shit. Im in HP tuners right now on my 13 6l80 and with dod activated the tcm can allow up to 60 rpm slip on the clutch. Working on a trans tune right now.
 

NickTransmissions

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10 RPM? holy shit. Im in HP tuners right now on my 13 6l80 and with dod activated the tcm can allow up to 60 rpm slip on the clutch. Working on a trans tune right now.
10 is the standard, 60 is a bit high but I think codes start setting at 80 or 100 RPM slip for two consecutive drive cycles...I take my own vehicles out periodically and watch the TCC slip speeds in lock up and they are usually around 10-15RPM at most.
 

Coolman1987us

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10 is the standard, 60 is a bit high but I think codes start setting at 80 or 100 RPM slip for two consecutive drive cycles...I take my own vehicles out periodically and watch the TCC slip speeds in lock up and they are usually around 10-15RPM at most.
I just watched a video on youtube from Matt Sanford about tuning the 6l80 stock trans and followed his steps, its like a whole new truck. Tcc slip set to zero and shift points remapped with bluecat software. unreal the potential GM leaves on the table. Still cant out power the brakes to do a burnout tho...
 

NickTransmissions

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I just watched a video on youtube from Matt Sanford about tuning the 6l80 stock trans and followed his steps, its like a whole new truck. Tcc slip set to zero and shift points remapped with bluecat software. unreal the potential GM leaves on the table. Still cant out power the brakes to do a burnout tho...
Yep, for sure...I always recommend a good electronic tune to coincide with my rebuilds and agree; not sure why GM tunes these units the way they do...
 

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The engine speed doesn't jump, or if it does its not noticeable. Just cruising listening to the radio, looking out at flat FL terrain and I see the CC light go off on the dash and feel the CC disengage. I never thought of why until it hadn't happened again until now. No biggy though. Driving around town all day today since it shuddered last thursday and all is well so far. Will keep an eye on it. Will wait to take it in until I'm positive they can recreate the issue. Will keep updating.
The CC clicking off is usually caused by a faulty brake pedal position switch. I had that problem on my '07 and a new switch solved the problem.
 
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olliec420

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The CC clicking off is usually caused by a faulty brake pedal position switch. I had that problem on my '07 and a new switch solved the problem.
Interesting, I'll check in to it. Thanks
 

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