Koons still at it with mark ups...

[Banks22]

So I thought GM told dealers they would hold back allocations if mark ups, looks to be the opposite when Koons is marking up ultimates $10-20k and they have FOUR of them! Total BS!

 

[Ketzer]

My local dealer has a XL Ultimate on the lot...$25k adjustment. Its all PR posturing by GM, they know and have known, they absolutely do not care.

It would be less insulting to me as a potential buyer if they would simply say " it's a free market... " instead of the blatant lie that they can't control what an "independent" dealership charges.

 

[WalleyeMikeIII]

Didn’t think the Denali was on the “list” of vehicles they were concerned with.

 

[Polo08816]

My local dealer has a XL Ultimate on the lot...$25k adjustment. Its all PR posturing by GM, they know and have known, they absolutely do not care.

It would be less insulting to me as a potential buyer if they would simply say " it's a free market... " instead of the blatant lie that they can't control what an "independent" dealership charges.

All they have to really do is just increase production and the markups go away. Markups also go away if their competitors introduce similar products in the same segment and increase production as well.

Also, dealers can always ask for markups. It doesn't necessarily mean the dealership will be able to sell the product at that price.

 

[esbrittain]

That’s crazy! No one around here (NC) marks anything above MSRP, or at least what I’ve seen. Some charge a $1k dealer add on fee, but they at least tint the windows and provide cargo mats or something else for that price. Now the “used” ones with 500+ miles are a different story

 

[swathdiver]

Free Enterprise folks. Buy it if you think it's a good deal, walk if you don't. Or make an offer, some folks are mighty proud of what they have and test the waters with high prices under the "greater fool theory".

 

[Stbentoak]

I bet w/in 2 weeks all 4 of them will be gone... Remember we screamed bloody ****** in 21 when someone asked 5k over 80K for a not missing anything loaded vehicle. Stomped our feet and said, "I won't pay it" "It will never stand, they will be 10K below sticker in a year!" Well, here we are...Those people don't look so dumb now... and are enjoying a vehicle not missing any chips...

 

[Banks22]

I bet w/in 2 weeks all 4 of them will be gone... Remember we screamed bloody ****** in 21 when someone asked 5k over 80K for a not missing anything loaded vehicle. Stomped our feet and said, "I won't pay it" "It will never stand, they will be 10K below sticker in a year!" Well, here we are...Those people don't look so dumb now... and are enjoying a vehicle not missing any chips...

I complain but at the same time I am looking at trading in our 2021 Tahoe premier for a Yukon xl ultimate at gms if the allocation gets accepted (doubtful). And this is only because I expect to get what I paid for my Tahoe a year and half ago, which in a normal market wouldn’t happen. So it works both ways, but I think $20k over is a bit much.

 

[bunky319]

Free Enterprise folks. Buy it if you think it's a good deal, walk if you don't. Or make an offer, some folks are mighty proud of what they have and test the waters with high prices under the "greater fool theory".

Agree with this 100%. Mark-ups work for some people, they don't work for others. Everyone's situation is different. No need for those who paid mark-ups a year ago to justify their decision. The market is always changing.

 

[ColeBlooded]

From a legal standpoint, i don't think the manufacturer has any control over what a franchised dealer sells their products for. Whether it's over or under MSRP. Any dealer that tries to sell me a vehicle for over MSRP won't get my business.

 

[Polo08816]

I bet w/in 2 weeks all 4 of them will be gone... Remember we screamed bloody ****** in 21 when someone asked 5k over 80K for a not missing anything loaded vehicle. Stomped our feet and said, "I won't pay it" "It will never stand, they will be 10K below sticker in a year!" Well, here we are...Those people don't look so dumb now... and are enjoying a vehicle not missing any chips...

There are far more choices for the consumer today than there were in 2021:
- Ford did not update their Expedition until 2022
- Stellantis didn't produce the Wagoneer/Grand Wagoneer at the time (or the Wagoneer L/Grand Wagoneer L for that matter)
- Toyota Sequoia wasn't updated

There's a bit of confirmation bias at play here as well.

 

[Stbentoak]

There are far more choices for the consumer today than there were in 2021:
- Ford did not update their Expedition until 2022
- Stellantis didn't produce the Wagoneer/Grand Wagoneer at the time (or the Wagoneer L/Grand Wagoneer L for that matter)
- Toyota Sequoia wasn't updated

There's a bit of confirmation bias at play here as well.

Well there is…but…I just remember post after post after post after post saying just wait a year and the market will be flooded with them and we will all be paying 10k off the sticker…..
No big deal… rant over….

 

[Polo08816]

Well there is…but…I just remember post after post after post after post saying just wait a year and the market will be flooded with them and we will all be paying 10k off the sticker…..
No big deal… rant over….

I will admit, you're right. It's a bit of a moving target.

It's like saying, "Just wait, the stock market will fall." It's a true statement - but without a correct time, the statement means little.

Supply chains have taken longer to recover than most people had estimated. And even if they do recover, we may not see that effect in the retail market until 3+ months later.

I think we have to see 22Q3 and 22Q4 sales results before we are more confident in whatever we think is happening.

I think the 2023 MY will be a significant recovery year. Once we get into the 2024 MY, we'll have inventory on dealer lots for MSRP or below.

 

[Matt Wilson II]

When people stop accepting the deals, they will end. As long as someone will pay large market adjustments, they will continue. Big dog, big nuts.

 

[Toasty]

I complain but at the same time I am looking at trading in our 2021 Tahoe premier for a Yukon xl ultimate at gms if the allocation gets accepted (doubtful). And this is only because I expect to get what I paid for my Tahoe a year and half ago, which in a normal market wouldn’t happen. So it works both ways, but I think $20k over is a bit much.

You're not likely to come out even on your 21. Trade in prices are dropping, will be even more so if you have to wait for your Ultimate

 

[Banks22]

You're not likely to come out even on your 21. Trade in prices are dropping, will be even more so if you have to wait for your Ultimate

I’ve been wondering, msrp was $79k, I got gms so after tax was like $76k. It’s almost paid off so I figured to be happy if I got $70k...? Guess we will see....

 

[suterusu]

People seem to forget what the S in MSRP stands for.

While I hate markups of any type (if you think these cute little Denali markups are crazy, you should see the six figure markups in Porsche land), people are quick to forget the DECADES of the consumer beating up dealerships for huge discounts. I don't blame them for trying to make some money back, not to mention volumes are WAY down, so they are probably still making less money even with these markups.

 

[ashabug]

Koons ALWAYS has markups, even before it was "popular". They are in the DMV area and when we moved up here we were warned to only test drive cars in the area, but to drive up to PA or over to WV to actually purchase a car. I am not even a little surprised they took their typical $5k markup and upped it even more during these times.

 

[Stbentoak]

Koons ALWAYS has markups, even before it was "popular". They are in the DMV area and when we moved up here we were warned to only test drive cars in the area, but to drive up to PA or over to WV to actually purchase a car. I am not even a little surprised they took their typical $5k markup and upped it even more during these times.

That’s not necessarily true. When I was a member of the Jeep forum, we used to do group buys with Koons and get 5 to 7% below invoice if we ordered 10+ vehicles in a group at a time. Many members would come across country to pick up their vehicle at a great discount that they couldn’t get locally.

 

[Polo08816]

Koons ALWAYS has markups, even before it was "popular". They are in the DMV area and when we moved up here we were warned to only test drive cars in the area, but to drive up to PA or over to WV to actually purchase a car. I am not even a little surprised they took their typical $5k markup and upped it even more during these times.

I think there are quite a few Koons dealerships. Koons Jeep/Ram in VA is well known for very competitive pricing. Koons in Clarksville, MD is overpriced.

That’s not necessarily true. When I was a member of the Jeep forum, we used to do group buys with Koons and get 5 to 7% below invoice if we ordered 10+ vehicles in a group at a time. Many members would come across country to pick up their vehicle at a great discount that they couldn’t get locally.