A bulk of performance questions.

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bajchi

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I have a 09 Tahoe 130xxx miles 5.3 4x4 stock everything except rims/tires

i want to get performance parts and basically just mess around
i also don't want to spend buckets of money (i dont really have a limit on spending just dont like the idea of dropping a few grand on a single thing)
everyone i see says intake, exhaust, and then tune
things i want to know

is there a intake exhaust tune combo that works best?
what is the difference between intakes? is there one that is better than the rest and which i should aim for?
i have seen k&n, volant, and cold air inductions mentioned but not many others do all these perform the same?

same thing with the exhaust setup
is there a header/exhaust combo that is good and won't break the bank?
i have seen $300 long tube headers and $1300 ones

could e85 be an option since mine is flex fuel

i have read about getting a cam or different gear ratios
i dont know anything about those really

is there other mostly diy mods i can do and get more power without sacrificing too much reliability?
are there things i should look into first before i think about more power?
are there basic maintenance things i should look for to get more performance out of a high mileage engine?
are there things i should outright avoid?
any info or pointing me to info would be great
i would love to see before and after numbers on a lot of these mods but can't find anything really.
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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a lot of info i look at is mostly dead links since most of it is old as well
 

08HoeCD

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Others will chime in but here's my 2 cents.

Forget the intake unless you like different sound and maybe a cool look in the engine bay. The stock intake is fine and a cold air intake won't do anything for performance other than maybe 1-2 extra hp.

Same with exhaust unless you go long-tube headers with a custom tune. By all means, change the exhaust for better sound, but it won't do anything for performance increase.

Best bang-for-the-buck steps for noticeable power/performance increase are installing a custom tune and changing your camshaft. Next would be adding long tube headers and next is adding a blower. But those steps are often a big jump up in cost.
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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are there supercharger options that dont cost 5k?
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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that price just doesnt seem feasible for me
 

HiHoeSilver

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Others will chime in but here's my 2 cents.

Forget the intake unless you like different sound and maybe a cool look in the engine bay. The stock intake is fine and a cold air intake won't do anything for performance other than maybe 1-2 extra hp.

Same with exhaust unless you go long-tube headers with a custom tune. By all means, change the exhaust for better sound, but it won't do anything for performance increase.

Best bang-for-the-buck steps for noticeable power/performance increase are installing a custom tune and changing your camshaft. Next would be adding long tube headers and next is adding a blower. But those steps are often a big jump up in cost.

But it will sound faster.... :driver:

http://www.tahoeyukonforum.com/threads/bbp-independent-intake-test-results.41254/
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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it looks like some of the options in that thread gave up to 19/20 more hp from the intake alone?
that seems too good to be true
 

iamdub

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is there a intake exhaust tune combo that works best?
what is the difference between intakes? is there one that is better than the rest and which i should aim for?
i have seen k&n, volant, and cold air inductions mentioned but not many others do all these perform the same?

Stock setup is already a "cold air intake". The flashy cone filters and metal pipes that everyone calls a "cold air intake" is most certainly NOT a CAI. NO "cold" air of any kind can be had by opening the filter element to the engine bay. They're for show and likely not as efficient at filtering out dirt so not only are you sucking in hot air (loss of power), you're sucking in dirty air which contaminates the oil and reduces engine life. "But they sure do look purty and sound kewl!"

About the only improvement that can be made is to smooth the flow of air from the filter box to the throttle body, so the Airaid MIT is ideal. You can spend big bucks on an aftermarket setup with a fully-enclosed filter box that ducts it's air from outside the engine bay. Or, you can keep the OEM setup that you already have that does that already. Still, any gains will likely be unnoticeable.

same thing with the exhaust setup
is there a header/exhaust combo that is good and won't break the bank?
i have seen $300 long tube headers and $1300 ones

Longtubes or stay stock. I highly recommend having headers coated since they radiate so much more heat into the engine bay than the stock cast iron manifolds. As far as the exhaust itself is concerned, the gases flowing from the exhaust port on the cylinder head, through a 2" primary tube, then though a 3" collector and into the 2.75" stock piping don't care what company made those pipes or even the metallurgy of the metal. So, aside from the minor brand design differences, a $300 set of headers will flow essentially the same as a $1,300 set. What you're paying for is the quality of stainless they are constructed of (metal thickness and rust resistance) and the quality of the design (fitment). If you don't live in a salted area, you should be fine with the cheaper headers. Yes, some alloys of stainless can and do rust. Just because something is made of "stainless" doesn't mean it won't rust.

Pretty much any free-flow muffler can help. There are countless options and you're gonna have to decide based on what you want and can research. Again, any gains just from the muffler will likely be unnoticeable.


could e85 be an option since mine is flex fuel

You can run it. Whether-or-not it's worth running depends on the cost per mile. E85 returns worse fuel economy, but it still may be the better value if it's cheap enough per gallon. Some report slightly more power when running it, though. You can get a tune to optimize running it, but then you'd always have to look for the stations that have it and this may not be so convenient in your area.

Speaking of fuel, these engines have consistently shown to run better on 89 octane or higher. I've noticed less or no detonation when running 89+ which surely should mean better performance since the PCM isn't retarding the timing to mitigate the detonation. If you insist on 87, just don't romp on it.


i have read about getting a cam or different gear ratios
i dont know anything about those really

Deleting AFM is advised nearly 100% of the time by nearly 100% of those concerned. You can disable AFM by having it turned off in a tune or with a plug-in module (Range device). But, actually removing the components is the only surefire way to avoid potentially catastrophic engine damage from an AFM lifter failing. One of the AFM components is the cam. So, when you're deleting the AFM system, it's a perfect time to install a performance cam.

Lower (numerically higher) gears can help with off-the-line performance which is where these engines lack grunt. But, it means the engine will be turning higher RPMs at any speed which, in most instances, means more fuel consumption.


is there other mostly diy mods i can do and get more power without sacrificing too much reliability?

Depends on what you consider "DIY". Take the aforementioned AFM delete for example. Swapping in a performance cam will get more power while INCREASING reliability. But, is a cam swap a DIY task for you?

Other than that, pretty much everything "DIY" are "bolt-ons": Intake, exhaust, tune, etc. and they won't sacrifice reliability if done properly.


are there things i should look into first before i think about more power?

Make sure all the basic maintenance/tune-up items are up-to-par: Fluids, filters, spark plugs, no leaking gaskets, belts, hoses, etc. Don't forget the transmission, transfer case, and differentials. Address any existing drivability/performance and maybe even emissions issues.

Check your engine mounts, particularly the driver's side one.


are there basic maintenance things i should look for to get more performance out of a high mileage engine?

See above. 130,*** miles is hardly "high mileage" on an LS-series engine. Although it IS in the "DANGER" territory for the AFM lifters. If yours ticks for a few seconds on startup after it's been sitting overnight, it's likely a worn lifter losing it's prime and even more likely that it's an AFM lifter. A small exhaust leak usually makes the same sound as a lifter and often subsides after a few seconds or minutes, so rule that out if you have ticking. The exhaust manifold bolts are notorious for breaking.

Check your tire pressures.


are there things i should outright avoid?

Hot air intakes, gimmicky spark plugs with multiple electrodes and/or made of unobtanium metals, throttle body spacer (unless it has nitrous and fuel nozzles in it :thumbsup:)...


any info or pointing me to info would be great
i would love to see before and after numbers on a lot of these mods but can't find anything really.

I've seen plenty of before and after dyno numbers on longtube headers to know they are a worthy investment. All the other bolt-ons are pretty much supporting mods. Cam gains vary wildly between grinds and tune gains vary wildly between tuning companies. Decide how far you wanna go with it based on your needs and proceed accordingly.

One thing's for sure, you don't have to spend thousands to get the most out of a naturally-aspirated Gen4. A few hundred on headers, a couple hundred on the MIT and muffler and a few hundred on a good tune (Black Bear;)) to optimize everything and it'll be as good as it can be and even set up for the bigger mods (cam, boost, etc.) if you want more later.
 
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swathdiver

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I have a 09 Tahoe 130xxx miles 5.3 4x4 stock everything except rims/tires

i want to get performance parts and basically just mess around
i also don't want to spend buckets of money (i dont really have a limit on spending just dont like the idea of dropping a few grand on a single thing)

Ya piddle around you get a piddling of performance. Save your coin and put a supercharger on it and pick up 125+ horsepower. For half the money and nearly the same increase in power, stick an L9H in there with a BlackBear tune.

For weekend piddling, AirAid MIT, BlackBear tune and go out and run E85 as soon as your tank runs low next time. Free horsepower.

Long tube headers will add about 20 rear wheel horsepower after a tune. A camshaft will deliver about the same.

My rig is stock save for the BlackBear tune and with a bad cat she made 302 rear wheel horsepower through the traps in the 1/4 mile. My next mod will be the AFM delete with a very mild camshaft. Keeping the stock manifolds. May someday run a new Flowmaster muffler with an outlet on each side just because. Same for AirAid MIT. I might even put the K&N air filter back in when the paper one gets dirty. Then I'll put in an 9-1/2" AXN rear differential. From there I'll either supercharge it or stroke it to 402 cubic inches if I'm still alive in twenty years!

As the engines get up in mileage, it is good to replace the pickup tube o-ring at the first sign of decreased oil pressure (not attributed to screen under sensor!) and maybe the oil pump. If you like AFM, upgrade the lifters and VLOM to the latest part numbers, and if not, upgrade the driver's side valve cover anyway to reduce oil consumption.

Don't cheap out on replacement parts or fluids, stick with GM OE or AC Delco Professional. Make sure the 100k service was performed and if not, get it done.

Before you do ANYTHING but fill it up with E85, go online and buy a Tech2 off ebay. More important than a wrench, you cannot successfully diagnose and work on your truck without one. It WILL pay for itself in short order with the first repairs.
 

sumo

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Nitrous.... but a supercharger will have you grinning ear to ear. I try to take it easy but i find my self punching it needlessly because it just sounds so awesome. I also find sharing that sound with others next to me is also awesome.....well at lest for me anyways
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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these are excelent answers and just what i was looking for thanks a bunch
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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Deleting AFM is advised nearly 100% of the time by nearly 100% of those concerned. You can disable AFM by having it turned off in a tune or with a plug-in module (Range device). But, actually removing the components is the only surefire way to avoid potentially catastrophic engine damage from an AFM lifter failing. One of the AFM components is the cam. So, when you're deleting the AFM system, it's a perfect time to install a performance cam.

can someone point me to a good reference of this process be chance?

is there a cam that is well known to be decent for these engines?
i do better with this kind of stuff when someone points me in the exact direction i need to go (like a parts list or something)
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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should i be getting lifters with a cam and afm delete
should i be getting a tune beforehand (am going with black bear)
would a tune be a fix for the afm temporarily?
i dont have any ticks but my father in laws truck up and died at 90k miles under those circumstances and needed a new engine ( i dont have that kind of money lying around)
 

swathdiver

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People who have done this work have posted here and on other forums and some have even made video, often time-lapsed, showing it being done. There are a number of speed shops offering AFM Delete Kits like Summit Racing, Jegs, Texas Speed and Performance, etc. or you can source the parts you want yourself.

I was preparing to do mine and made a list of all the OE parts until I learned that the whole system had been rebuilt right before I bought my truck. So my AFM delete was put on the back burner for a while.

Many of us, myself included, have AFM turned off in the tune and still retain all the hardware. It can still fail, just as regular lifters do, just not as likely.

I see lots of folks picking out big camshafts advertised as small ones not requiring high stall torque converters. Many of them sound awesome but we never see real world dyno or track results or the affect on mileage and street manners. I'm an advocate for keeping the lift so low as to not require new valve springs. And the duration also low, under 210 to keep the powerband as close to original as possible. Many camshafts lose 20-40 ft lbs of torque between idle and 3000 rpms and add it back above that number. That maybe fine for a drag car, corvette or racing truck with a high stall converter and lower gears but not one with stock street manners.
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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ok so i have looked into it a bit more
is there a cam kit for a gen 3 cam with new lifter springs/anything else needed that i could do at the same time as the afm delete
or something like it?

the idea of taking apart the top of the engine doesnt bother me the more research i do
would a vvt delete be a good option while i am doing this as well?
 

swathdiver

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ok so i have looked into it a bit more
is there a cam kit for a gen 3 cam with new lifter springs/anything else needed that i could do at the same time as the afm delete
or something like it?

the idea of taking apart the top of the engine doesnt bother me the more research i do
would a vvt delete be a good option while i am doing this as well?

If you're going to run a Gen III camshaft you have to delete VVT. Almost all of the camshafts are Gen III so we have to slightly modify our Gen IVs to run them. TSP is one of the few companies that makes a Gen IV cam to work with VVT. @randeez
 
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bajchi

bajchi

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If you're going to run a Gen III camshaft you have to delete VVT. Almost all of the camshafts are Gen III so we have to slightly modify our Gen IVs to run them. TSP is one of the few companies that makes a Gen IV cam to work with VVT. @randeez
that makes sense and the vvt delete kit from summit looks like it includes all parts you would be taking off to change the cam anyways and isnt too expensive
if i got one of those kits and one of the afm delete kits from them as well will those lifters in that kit be compatible with a gen 3 cam
and also is there a cam that would be recommended? i was also reading that new springs would be good to go with the cam as well does someone have product recommendations? i dont know anything about the different autoparts brands really.

https://help.summitracing.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/4858
"Performance valvetrain parts from the LS1, LS2, and LS6 fit these heads. Spring Kits are available for typical 0.600 in. lift cam upgrades. Titanium retainers are another option to reduce Valve Float. For those on a tighter budget, an LS3 cam and LS6 valve springs alone can make 50 extra horsepower.."
 

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