BREAKING: GM is officially recalling the L87

[Vladimir2306]

Ha, did you even read the bulletin?)) Cars that are owned by the owners do not fall under it)) Only unsold cars that are at dealers fall under it))) So you can not wait for an invitation))

 

[squark]

I have an oil change scheduled this week and called my dealer to see if they’re doing the recall yet. They said they’re not, but they ordered pallets of Mobil 1 Supercar 0W-40 and are using that in all the 6.2s. So I’ll pay for this oil change using the new oil, but the next one will be on GM under the recall.

My service advisor said that under the recall they’ll cut open the oil filter to inspect for metallic flakes. If they find any, they’ll replace the engine. I’m not sure if that’s a GM or a dealer thing, because the bulletin just mentioned checking for codes.

The other thing is the new oil is more expensive. My dealer is charging $37 more for the oil change with the Mobil 1 Supercar formula. They said it’s $90 just for the oil, so they charge $147 now for an oil change (up from $110). It’d be nice if GM subsidized the cost of the oil since this is their problem, but I’m sure that’ll never happen.

 

[jfoj]

Ha, did you even read the bulletin?)) Cars that are owned by the owners do not fall under it)) Only unsold cars that are at dealers fall under it))) So you can not wait for an invitation))

While you are reading correctly, this will cover all vehicles list under the NHTSA window.

The NHTSA recall document has not even been released last I checked.

What may not be done is inspecting for the P0016 codes for sold vehicles.

This overall has been poorly written from a number of angles. If you look at page 3 of this document it clearly states that this recall should be performed regardless of age or mileage on the vehicle. Is this only for used vehicles that come into a dealer? Is this for all vehicles? It should be for the vehicles that were listed under the NHTSA investigation. But again, I think this document is an internal GM document and they put a stop sale order out first because they will not have the parts available in large quantities any time soon.

The "official' NHTSA document has not even been released from what I found last I looked. NHTSA Campaign Number 25V274 did not show up on the NHTSA web site late yesterday when I last looked and given this is a Federal Government agency, I doubt they will upload anything over the weekend.

 

[Vladimir2306]

And also, an independent transition to 0-40 oil will mean a violation of the operating conditions, and removal from the car warranty. So I would not rush into these actions yet

 

[KMeloney]

Ha, did you even read the bulletin?)) Cars that are owned by the owners do not fall under it)) Only unsold cars that are at dealers fall under it))) So you can not wait for an invitation))

Regardless of what THAT document says, the GMC App has alerted me that my VIN falls under this, and my truck isn’t in the dealer’s inventory. So, that document may describe what should be done for vehicles on lots, but obviously there is/will be other documentation that says what should happen with all the other vehicles that the public owns.

 

[jfoj]

And also, an independent transition to 0-40 oil will mean a violation of the operating conditions, and removal from the car warranty. So I would not rush into these actions yet

The higher viscosity oil will not cause a catastrophic oil related failure, it will hopefully prevent one. Dealers would need to send an oil sample out to determine if the viscosity is higher than 0W20 and I have never seen a dealer do this. The techs rarely even check the oil before they tear and engine apart.

My neighbor with the 2025 is so happy he listened to me and dumped the 0W20 at 400 miles before he took a 1000 mile road trip to the warm South.

 

[Scarey]

“And also, an independent transition to 0-40 oil will mean a violation of the operating conditions, and removal from the car warranty. So I would not rush into these actions yet”

If gm tried to weasel out of a warranty claim based on this, it would be a fun one to fight. It’s ridiculous to think they would try. I have an oil change scheduled in one week. The only question is if they have the new oil by then. And yes, I’ll pay for it if they don’t have the process in place by then.

 

[Lonny]

I just received an Alert notification in the MyCadillac app about the recall. I already have a dealer visit scheduled for Tuesday - what should I be expecting/asking of them to do?

 

[KMeloney]

I just received an Alert notification in the MyCadillac app about the recall. I already have a dealer visit scheduled for Tuesday - what should I be expecting/asking of them to do?

I think THEY should be telling YOU what they’re going to do. But it sounds like they should be “inspecting” your engine to see if it requires replacing (or “just” requires different weight oil and a new filler cap). Now how they’re going to inspect the engine, I have no idea. I don’t see what they can learn without physically getting into the engine— and that sounds involved.

 

[WalleyeMikeIII]

“And also, an independent transition to 0-40 oil will mean a violation of the operating conditions, and removal from the car warranty. So I would not rush into these actions yet”

If gm tried to weasel out of a warranty claim based on this, it would be a fun one to fight. It’s ridiculous to think they would try. I have an oil change scheduled in one week. The only question is if they have the new oil by then. And yes, I’ll pay for it if they don’t have the process in place by then.

Just go to wal mart and pick it up. Take it with, and tell the dealer to just charge you labor.

 

[viven44]

Bottom line if you want your 6.2l to live a long life, I recommend these things.

1. Run only Premium fuel, preferable Top Tier fuel or BP/Amoco with Invigorate
2. Regularly run something like Techron Total Fuel System Cleaner in the fuel tank, I run it at 50% strength full time at the moment.
3. If you have a 2024 or older model, get a Range DFM disabler
4. Run in L9 around town up to 55 MPH
5. Install a catch can and empty is every 2000-2500 miles
6. DO NOT run 0W20 engine oil, seems GM want 0W40, I run Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 0W40, it is NOT Dexos Approved, but it likely would pass Dexos testing with flying colors. Pennzoil does not want to give GM the oil formulation which is a REQUIREMENT for Dexos approval. There are other vendors that do not want to give GM their oil formulation for their higher end oils. Low Sodium is one of the major requirements of Dexos approval and Pennzoil Ultra Platinum meets this requirement.
7. Change your oil every 3000-4500 miles depending on driving conditions. Consider watching the OLM and see what 50% is in mileage and maybe you can use 50% of the OLM as the reference.
8. DO NOT drive the vehicle less than 30 minutes when the temps are below 45F. You really need to drive these vehicles a minimum of 20 minutes almost every trip. Even at 80F it take 20 minute of driving to get the engine oil up to 200F.
9. DO NOT start and allow the engine to idle for warm ups, start the engine, allow the RPM to drop to 700-800 RPM, then drive the vehicle. The oil warms up far faster when driving vs idle.
10. Check your oil every at least other fill up, which is about 1000 miles depending on how the vehicle is driven. DO NOT wait until the low oil light comes on.
11. Keep your oil level at the TOP of the dipstick hash marks. I run 9 quarts at oil change, these engines take more than 8 quarts of oil with filter, check your oil when you put 8 quarts in, you will see the oil level will be about 2/3 down the hash marks on the dipstick.
12. Get a magnetic oil drain plug and install it. It can be a good reference for iron in the crankcase, it may not solve many problems, but GM cheaped out and did away with these. My 2005 6.0l has one and it has been useful to track what is going on in the engine. my 2005 6.0l has 275,000 miles, I hope I can get at least 1/2 of this with the 6.2l??

@jfoj , what if a soccer mom decides she doesn't want to follow your 12 commandments, except #6, can she get away by simply going to 0W-40, maybe changing oil every 5000 miles .... asking for a friend ? If your answer is no, then it might be worth just trading the 6.2L for a 5.3L or a diesel and move on with life as normal.

Speaking of other engines, I was just checking the 2500HD pickups.... 6.6L rated for ~15/20 MPG.... same as the 1500 pickups with the 6.2L @~15/20 MPG. Just a quick search.. one of the links I found

6.6L has no DFM and a bit more low end torque.... the HD truck's Tare weight is also probably a good 1000 lbs more.... what am I missing ??? It would seem the same 6.6L engine would actually do better on a 1500 or family hauler platform.

 

[Marky Dissod]

6.6L has no DFM and a bit more low end torque ... the HD truck's Tare weight is also probably a good 1000 lbs more ... what am I missing ???
I'd take a wild guess and say it is because of the torque curve.

You're missing the fact that vehicles equipped with the L8T are not subject to any CAFE MpG restrictions.
GM is under no compunction or coercion to upshift as early as possible, or to hesitate with downshifts.
Further, vehicles with L8Ts (2500 & up pickups ONLY) are typically not sold for soccer moms,
rather for those who are either towing or hauling much more than kids'n'stuff.

But yeah, if L8T vehicles WERE sold in vehicles typically sold to soccer moms,
and if L8T vehicles WERE under the CAFE MpG thumb,
wouldn't surprise me if the L8T upshifted even earlier than an L87 to keep RpMs even lower.

 

[viven44]

You're missing the fact that vehicles equipped with the L8T are not subject to any CAFE MpG restrictions.

No... I am well aware of that, thats just one of the reasons I prefer 3/4 or 1 ton trucks is historically they have been exempt from a lot of emissions bottlenecks (my 84 1-ton pickup has no cats from factory for example when the 1/2 tons of the same year had cats... this trend has continued over the years... no VVT c**p on the HD trucks in the 2000s across different manufacturers.... and now all the way to DFM).

My point is that the 6.6L's advertised MPG on the 2500HD is the same as the 6.2L on the 1500s (higher tare weight on the 2500 as well)... it would seem GM would meet CAFE MPG requirements a lot better focusing on the 6.6L platform....

Per google AI
2500HD curb/tare weight - 6,267 to 7,804 pounds
1500 curb/tare weight - 4,410 to 5,710 pounds

 

[AliBaba]

This whole topic is making me feel unhappy with my vehicle knowing it’s a ticking time bomb every time I start it.

 

[jfoj]

@viven44

I had already looked at the 6.6l vs the 6.2l and I think except for the roller lifers as a whole and DI the 6.6l would clearly be a better overall engine for the application. As configured in the 2500 series or higher models, the 6.6l does not have DFM and the Auto Stop/Start feature as well. The lack of these 2 features alone is a BIG improvement toward reliability. Unsure if the fuel economy is as close as they claim it is, but it may be possible that the pickup might weigh in similar to a Suburban or Yukon XL.

The oil spec for the 6.6l is 5W30 vs the trash 0W20 that is compromising all the other engines. But there a some other problems that still need to be considered. The 6.6l is still Direct Injected and still needs Premium Fuel due to the 10.8:1 compression ration. While 5W30 oil spec is a far better option for engine longevity, the DI will still possibly overly fuel dilute the engine oil on short runs and the only way to fully clear the fuel out of the oil is to change it. Sure some may "cook" out at the engine oil gets up to 200+F, but not all of it. My mantra, change oil, change often, change frequently if you want your engine to survive, oil is cheaper than steel. Part of the way to offset the guaranteed fuel dilution it to start out with a higher viscosity oil so during the life of the oil it still can properly lubricate the engine components.

You still get into the same problem of a larger oil sump and trying to warm up the engine oil as both the 6.2l and the 6.6l have effectively the same oil capacity, spec'ed at 8.0 quarts, but I will not comment further on this here.

The fuel issue overall is still the same, with DI engines the fuel injectors are now in a very harsh environment, firing directly into the combustion chamber and combustion by products can build up on/in the fuel injectors, so doing everything reasonable in your power to try to reduce deposit build up on/in the injectors is important.

Probably the best overall configuration would be a 6.6l with Port Fuel Injections, Roller lifters with bushings vs roller bearings and run probably a 10W40 engine oil given the massive low end torque these engines are being subjected to at 1500 RPM on a regular basis. This would be about as old school as you could get close to the oil Vortec 6000 6.0L. But the old 6.0l did not have the torque of the current engines and also ran at higher RPM's so they were far more difficult to kill. Case in point, my 2005 Yukon Denali is still going strong at 275,000 miles.

Then there is the transmission. Seems that this is also a weak point as well, mainly with the valve body. The 2500+ series has a slightly beefier transmission, GM claims it is an Allison transmission, but it is not. GM licensed the Allison name for use on the heavy duty trucks, a MARKETING stunt. These are the same as the 10L80/10L90 with some beefer parts, but effectively the same valve body with the same valve body problems! I think if you addressed the valve body with an aftermarket solution, then the pump drive gears might be the next biggest weak link.

Bottom line is for a Soccer Mom/Kid Hauler a Honda mini van is probably a better option with how fragile todays powertrain configurations are. The smaller oil sumps heat up quicker, the lower vehicle weight mean less crazy loading on the engine, but the engine compression ration is still 11.5:1. But is this a static compression ration? Understand that some compression ratios are listed very high, but with camshaft timing and overlap they often end up with with a lower dynamic compression ratio. Not sure what Honda does and if they recommend Premium fuel.

Unfortunately where were are all today is life is a compromise. Bean counters and bureaucrats have all decided what choices we have to purchase these days. Unfortunately gone are the days where thing were easier to maintain and operate and would actually last a long time. Once we moved to gasoline DI and the Cadillac 4-6-8 world we are all screwed. The Cadillac 4-6-8 was a bad idea in 1981, but all the engineers that knew better are retired or dead at this point. The CAFE requirements were a knee jerk reaction to the early 1970's oil embargo and OPEC controlling the oil prices and the US wanting to not be caught off guard on oil dependency. It then morphed into the Energy Policy and Conservation Act and the Energy Independence and Security Act. These non technical law makers and government agencies sat is a room and just decided what the auto industry would need to meet as far as fuel economy standards without taking into consideration much science or industry feedback on what is actually reasonably achievable. So we are al victims here!

 

[22BlackDenali]

This whole topic is making me feel unhappy with my vehicle knowing it’s a ticking time bomb every time I start it.

Feeling the same. I just configured a vehicle with the 3.0 duramax. I would just like to know final plans on how GM plans to handle this before jumping the gun. Seems like the 3.0 maybe a better situation than the one we're in with 6.2. Spent last night watching Youtube engine review videos. Anyone got any horror stories with the 3.0? Afraid to ask....

 

[WalleyeMikeIII]

This whole topic is making me feel unhappy with my vehicle knowing it’s a ticking time bomb every time I start it.

^^^ This!

At least now maybe we are covered a bit (save the inconvenience) if it happens. Need to coin a new term, here are some options:
L87 Life Anxiety
L87 Bearing Anxiety
L87 Grenade Anxiety
L87 Blow Anxiety
….

Just trying to lighten the mood…happy Monday y’all

 

[jfoj]

It just L87 Range Anxiety.

What is the range or how many miles before the engine, transmission valve body or fuel pump control module leaves you stranded.

I get it, I am not so comfortable driving now that I know all the risks, but I can only do so much other than pulling the engine and reworking the bearings and modifying the oiling system. I am not happy about any of this, but I am doing everything in my power to minimize the risks.

With the engine, you have to be on top of the oil level, oil type, oil changes. Run Premium Fuel and do not take short trips. Turn off/bypass the Auto Stop/Start system. Drive in L9 up to 55 MPH or get a DFM defeat device for the 2024 and older models. Sorry 2025, nothing on the market yet to help you guys out.

With the transmission valve body, well you can cross your fingers or proactively repair it, is my plan is to proactively rework the valve body, all parts on hand, now I need 3-4 hours of uninterrupted time. Can other things in the transmission fail, sure, but the valve body is a known problem and has been since the 6 speeds. Also change the trans fluid every 30,000 miles.

Fuel Pump Control Module (FCPM) is an easy one. For about $65 you can carry a spare in the vehicle, easy to swap under the vehicle in about 5 minutes, then about 15 minutes once you can get around to removing the bracket and actually properly installing it.

 

[Vladimir2306]

Bottom line if you want your 6.2l to live a long life, I recommend these things.

1. Run only Premium fuel, preferable Top Tier fuel or BP/Amoco with Invigorate
2. Regularly run something like Techron Total Fuel System Cleaner in the fuel tank, I run it at 50% strength full time at the moment.
3. If you have a 2024 or older model, get a Range DFM disabler
4. Run in L9 around town up to 55 MPH
5. Install a catch can and empty is every 2000-2500 miles
6. DO NOT run 0W20 engine oil, seems GM want 0W40, I run Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 0W40, it is NOT Dexos Approved, but it likely would pass Dexos testing with flying colors. Pennzoil does not want to give GM the oil formulation which is a REQUIREMENT for Dexos approval. There are other vendors that do not want to give GM their oil formulation for their higher end oils. Low Sodium is one of the major requirements of Dexos approval and Pennzoil Ultra Platinum meets this requirement.
7. Change your oil every 3000-4500 miles depending on driving conditions. Consider watching the OLM and see what 50% is in mileage and maybe you can use 50% of the OLM as the reference.
8. DO NOT drive the vehicle less than 30 minutes when the temps are below 45F. You really need to drive these vehicles a minimum of 20 minutes almost every trip. Even at 80F it take 20 minute of driving to get the engine oil up to 200F.
9. DO NOT start and allow the engine to idle for warm ups, start the engine, allow the RPM to drop to 700-800 RPM, then drive the vehicle. The oil warms up far faster when driving vs idle.
10. Check your oil every at least other fill up, which is about 1000 miles depending on how the vehicle is driven. DO NOT wait until the low oil light comes on.
11. Keep your oil level at the TOP of the dipstick hash marks. I run 9 quarts at oil change, these engines take more than 8 quarts of oil with filter, check your oil when you put 8 quarts in, you will see the oil level will be about 2/3 down the hash marks on the dipstick.
12. Get a magnetic oil drain plug and install it. It can be a good reference for iron in the crankcase, it may not solve many problems, but GM cheaped out and did away with these. My 2005 6.0l has one and it has been useful to track what is going on in the engine. my 2005 6.0l has 275,000 miles, I hope I can get at least 1/2 of this with the 6.2l??

Everyone has opinions, I have done a lot of research and data logging on my truck and I know what is going on, so the above rule are what I follow. My oil has been changed 3 times in the first 6,000 miles. I have performed oil analysis on every oil drain.

Do what you want and fell is right, but

I will give comments on your list.
1. Yes, 6.2 is built on Premium fuel.
2. No, this is not necessary if you use Premium Fuel.
3. Range DFM is a pointless story because the DFM system itself works, it is just not active. If you want to remove DFM, you need to do it at the level of mechanical removal, software removal will not solve the problem.
4. This is the same as point 3, L9 simply does not turn off the cylinders, but the DFM itself is present and working.
5. maybe, on the other hand, why? The oil ends up going to the catalyst and burning there.
6. Here everything is debatable, our observations say that the DFM system dies on oil with idex 40, the transition to GM in this case is a choice of the lesser of two evils, yes, the engine probably will not die from wear of connecting rod bearings at a mileage of 10-20 thousand miles, but the DFM will start to fail at a mileage of 70-80 thousand miles, but this will most likely be after the warranty period. So, I continue to drive on oil 0-20. I talked to mechanics, they said that it is not worth switching to 0-40 oil.
7. There is no point at all, modern oils retain their properties for 7-8 thousand miles without problems. In Europe, there is a Longlife standard, where the oil is changed every 20-30 thousand kilometers. And cars there travel 300-500 thousand kilometers without problems. I change the oil according to the regulations, every 7,5 thousand miles.
8. This advice is really stupid, any driving or starting of the engine wears it out, so now, don't drive at all? Lol)
9. This is also stupid, yes, the engine must warm up systematically so that the temperature gaps take their place. And when a cold engine is given a little load, wear appears. Everyone knows that the worst thing for an engine is a cold start, even the engine software counts the number of these cold starts. So only warming up, even in summer, 1-2 minutes of warming up before moving off, and in winter 5-10 minutes of warming up is mandatory.
10. Yes.
11. Yes
12. This is also not necessary, it is enough to check the oil level on a white paper napkin. Metal particles will be immediately noticeable if they are present.
Well, in general, as a summary, I would not be so active in giving advice in public that is so clearly different from the manufacturer's recommendations. I understand that we are sharing opinions here, but the Manufacturer will be held legally responsible for his recommendations, and we will not answer to each other here.

 

[AliBaba]

Feeling the same. I just configured a vehicle with the 3.0 duramax. I would just like to know final plans on how GM plans to handle this before jumping the gun. Seems like the 3.0 maybe a better situation than the one we're in with 6.2. Spent last night watching Youtube engine review videos. Anyone got any horror stories with the 3.0? Afraid to ask....

I’m thinking the same thing. I got out of my 2500 Dualramax and now kicking myself. I need the 7 seater so Maine the 3.0 diesel is the next best thing.