Apparently Ford doesn't like profits: alienating the majority of Americans

[Bocephous]

Here is something else to consider: If people want to force the world off fossil fuels, exhaust fossil fuels -- don't conserve them! I'm doing my part by having all my family in V8 trucks...

If I had the power to do so I'd double down on the extraction of "fossil" fuels. We have a lot of them, gas and coal in my area, and by not utilizing our own natural resources we're willingly held hostage to our "enemies" by our backward policies. The whole "climate change" agenda is an attempt to wring more money from tax (extortion) paying citizens. When I was a kid it was "another ice age is coming." Next it was "global warming." Now it's "climate change." Follow the science? "Science" can't make up it's mind. It's all about fleecing us.
Winter of 2019-2020 the price I paid for a ton of bagged nut coal was $234.50, which I thought was reasonable. I live in NEPA, close to where it is extracted. Fast forward to winter of 2022-2023 and the price had jumped to $499 for the same coal from the same store.

 

[the 18th letter]

IMO the push for electric vehicles without a push for a solar and wind powered charging infrastructure leads me to believe it ain’t about the environment.

 

[homesick]

That is the theory, but...

I don't understand the "but". There's no conflict or disagreement here.

joe

 

[Bocephous]

I don't understand the "but". There's no conflict or disagreement here.

joe

I misunderstood your statement. My point being even if government decides it is going to take them away my rights still exist. Their attempting to do so is exercising power that hasn't been granted to them.

 

[S33k3r]

The only God-given role that government (and government officials) plays is securing my God-given rights with righteous force, if need be. But they don't. In their reprobate minds good is evil and evil is good.

I agree with EVERYTHING you said but this. Government, in and of itself, is not evil. It is the people who make it up that either wield righteous force or tyrannical power. Government, however, allows people to use power, and that corrupts a lot of people.

 

[S33k3r]

If I had the power to do so I'd double down on the extraction of "fossil" fuels. We have a lot of them, gas and coal in my area, and by not utilizing our own natural resources we're willingly held hostage to our "enemies" by our backward policies. The whole "climate change" agenda is an attempt to wring more money from tax (extortion) paying citizens. When I was a kid it was "another ice age is coming." Next it was "global warming." Now it's "climate change." Follow the science? "Science" can't make up it's mind. It's all about fleecing us.
Winter of 2019-2020 the price I paid for a ton of bagged nut coal was $234.50, which I thought was reasonable. I live in NEPA, close to where it is extracted. Fast forward to winter of 2022-2023 and the price had jumped to $499 for the same coal from the same store.

:Gulp: I *totally* agree. Climate Change is what is used to try to tame the 800 lb gorilla in the room (the United States).

 

[S33k3r]

IMO the push for electric vehicles without a push for a solar and wind powered charging infrastructure leads me to believe it ain’t about the environment.

This is a conspiracy theory, but it seems so true: Forcing us into electric vehicles without the proper infrastructure gives government control of our free movement from place to place.

 

[homesick]

Like everything else without a will of its own, gov't is a tool; not inherently good or evil.

It just attracts more of the sociopaths, greedy, and crooks than wrenches do.

joe

 

[Bocephous]

I agree with EVERYTHING you said but this. Government, in and of itself, is not evil. It is the people who make it up that either wield righteous force or tyrannical power. Government, however, allows people to use power, and that corrupts a lot of people.

Theoretically I agree with this. And I do agree we need government, for the reason I listed. And I also agree that the people in government are the problem. I'll also go one step beyond this and say this: as someone who trys to pour everything I learn through the sieve that is the Bible I understand that there is a power behind those people. And that power is not God. It is allowed by God, but it is not Him.

All that to say I agree with everything you wrote there, but I'd add to it.

 

[swathdiver]

If folks knew the truth about "fossil" fuels, that oil is made in the earth and does not come from extinct dinosaurs, the push for EVs would soon vanish and "they" would move on to another lie and get rich quick scheme.

 

[Doubeleive]

it's funny how "climate change" is pushed like it is something new, it's not and anyone with a brain knows this. what were once great forest are now desert and vica-versa, droughts come and go, animals and fish migrate, birds fly half way across the planet.
They push that oh' these are dying or this is going extinct, yep and something else will take it's place or they will be found in a new place that's how it works
we also know "people" migrated over thousands of years, now that's not so easy. you can't just pick up your house and move it north for the summer.
regardless of the "current cause" of climate change it would happen anyway...... so
I have personally seen marine fossils in the mountains, and tree's that have turned to rock in the desert, I have seen how ice moves rocks and creates valleys, how volcano's explode. so that tells me a lot, that tells me the TRUTH.

 

[S33k3r]

If folks knew the truth about "fossil" fuels, that oil is made in the earth and does not come from extinct dinosaurs, the push for EVs would soon vanish and "they" would move on to another lie and get rich quick scheme.

I'm going to have to disagree here. The only thing that will make those people change is a different or more efficient means of acquiring power.

 

[S33k3r]

it's funny how "climate change" is pushed like it is something new, it's not and anyone with a brain knows this. what were once great forest are now desert and vica-versa, droughts come and go, animals and fish migrate, birds fly half way across the planet.
They push that oh' these are dying or this is going extinct, yep and something else will take it's place or they will be found in a new place that's how it works
we also know "people" migrated over thousands of years, now that's not so easy. you can't just pick up your house and move it north for the summer.
regardless of the "current cause" of climate change it would happen anyway...... so
I have personally seen marine fossils in the mountains, and tree's that have turned to rock in the desert, I have seen how ice moves rocks and creates valleys, how volcano's explode. so that tells me a lot, that tells me the TRUTH.

It's not that climate change isn't natural. The fallacy (for me) is that man is artificially affecting it, to the planet's detriment. *I* do not believe this, and find it very arrogant of the people who do believe it. The earth has been around for millions of years. And it is going to be around long after we are gone/evolved/whatever.

I just want to be clear what my opinions are and not aggravate anyone that disagrees with me. The people in this forum are way too great for me to want to ever do that.

 

[Geotrash]

It's not that climate change isn't natural. The fallacy (for me) is that man is artificially affecting it, to the planet's detriment. *I* do not believe this, and find it very arrogant of the people who do believe it. The earth has been around for millions of years. And it is going to be around long after we are gone/evolved/whatever.

I just want to be clear what my opinions are and not aggravate anyone that disagrees with me. The people in this forum are way too great for me to want to ever do that.

I'm a petroleum geologist by education and early career, which makes me fiscally conservative by today's standards. I know how important oil is to our fortunes in this country and have no illusions about that. And I studied paleoclimatology, for what it's worth, so I think in long time periods and know how resilient the earth is, and I have faith in human ingenuity to solve any problems ahead of us.

In my mind, it's a false choice between realities that are both demonstrably true. Humans having a huge impact on global climate AND that EV's (and heavy-handed regulation) aren't the solution can BOTH be true. Humans, and especially Americans, NEED to feel free to make the choices that best fit our individual circumstances. That's who we are. So, too much regulation that limits personal choice and freedom is a non-starter.

I'd rather see the debate move on from arguing what's true, to finding solutions to both realities that won't result in loss of freedoms or diminished functionality of what we buy (e.g. AFM). There has to be a way.

I also wonder how many people here remember what the air quality was like in Pittsburgh, Denver or LA in the mid '70s. I do. Buildings and churches stained dark gray. Huge clouds of smog hanging over cities.

 

[S33k3r]

I'm a petroleum geologist by education and early career, which makes me fiscally conservative by today's standards. I know how important oil is to our fortunes in this country and have no illusions about that. And I studied paleoclimatology, for what it's worth, so I think in long time periods and know how resilient the earth is, and I have faith in human ingenuity to solve any problems ahead of us.

In my mind, it's a false choice between realities that are both demonstrably true. Humans having a huge impact on global climate AND that EV's (and heavy-handed regulation) aren't the solution can BOTH be true. Humans, and especially Americans, NEED to feel free to make the choices that best fit our individual circumstances. That's who we are. So, too much regulation that limits personal choice and freedom is a non-starter.

I'd rather see the debate move on from arguing what's true, to finding solutions to both realities that won't result in loss of freedoms or diminished functionality of what we buy (e.g. AFM). There has to be a way.

I also wonder how many people here remember what the air quality was like in Pittsburgh, Denver or LA in the mid '70s. I do. Buildings and churches stained dark gray. Huge clouds of smog hanging over cities.

I want to address your last statements first: When I left Los Angeles in 1995 (to come to Texas), you could still see the air almost daily. That said, I've hear more than one Angelino state, "How can you trust air you can't see?" The point here is that I do remember air pollution levels of the past, I'm also sensitive to air pollution (i.e. respiratory issues/allergies), and Dallas, on a bad day, smogs up just like Los Angeles.

Ultimately, I'd like to change our stance from conserving our oil and gas resources to running them out as quickly as we can. We conserved resources so they wouldn't run out while we invented alternatives. Clearly that strategy did not work. So you use them up and we will find alternatives. But as long as oil/gas are available, we are disincentivised to try to build something else.

"Petroleum Geologist": Before I moved to Texas, it never occurred to me there were such things. After moving to Texas, there are two of them in our friend circle! And I live Dallas, NOT Houston.

 

[Geotrash]

"Petroleum Geologist": Before I moved to Texas, it never occurred to me there were such things. After moving to Texas, there are two of them in our friend circle! And I live Dallas, NOT Houston.

This part of your message made me remember something that made me laugh when I first read it years ago. Share it with your geologist friends and I bet they'll howl.

Recent letter to Ann Landers

www.daleeasley.com

 

[mountie]

"Facts" verses "imagination" / " cult thought" / " money"......
In the long run of ownership, considering tax subsidies we all pay into, ( manufacturing & purchasing an EV ), home charging / electric usage-fees, tire wear due to the weight of an EV, resale value , etc, ....
EV : $17.00 .......
Gasoline powered : $ 3.00......
PER GALLON USAGE COST.

 

[mountie]

STUPIDITY : " Sustainable / Renewable" fuels.......
Formula 1, INDY Car, etc., .....
REALLY??? 'Fossil Fuel'.... Pumped out of the ground, transported to a refinery into gasoline, then trucked to gas stations, ( and remaining liquids used for 90% of everything we use.

" Renewable Energy Fuel" .... Methanol, etc....: Diesel powered machines to prepare the thousand acres of earth, pesticides to protect the grain, managing the grain ( farm equipment), MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF WATER for irrigation, harvesting the grain, ( farm equipment), trucking the grain to a processing plant ( energy by fossil fuels), Transporting to a chemical plant, trucking to gas stations, .... ETC..... NOT TO MENTION THE TAX-PAID SUBSIDIES....

YEA, RIGHT...... Thanks to the " No Oil " protestors, we will save the Planet..... Yea, Right...

( This is not 'political'...... Just mechanics..... )