Disabling the disabler!

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Extrememri1

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I have an AFM disabler (BOOST) plugged in, and I'm overall very happy with it. Although it definitely affects my gas mileage, being in V8 mode full-time, it's better than having a blown transmission. My question is this, does anyone ever pull them out when taking long, open road trips, when they know they will be coasting on cruise control in V4 getting that better mpg? (2015 Tahoe LT)
 

tooleyondeck

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I'm curious to see your data on AFM resulting in a measurable gas mileage increase! I never noticed a difference at all.

I only used a disabler to delay lifter failure, which IMO removing for long trips would defeat the purpose.
 

Marky Dissod

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... does anyone ever pull them out when taking long, open road trips, when they know they will be coasting on cruise control in V4 getting better MpG?
Cruise control is not how you get better MpG anyway; if the vehicle speed goes too far under the cruise control setpoint the engine'll go V8 anyway,
transmission may even kick down a gear or two, **** goes MpG.

The Engine Half@$$ MpG benefit is maybe 2 or 3MpG highway, and as the engine ages it fades over time anyway.

EDIT: don't even remember what I originally typed that got redacted by this forum's insult to George Carlin ...
 
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15burban

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Has anyone ever hooked up a scanner and watched the injector duty cycles while driving and when it goes to 4 popper mode? I've seen screenshots from a ram where when the mds (4 cylinder mode) kicks in it doubles the injector duty cycle of the 4 active cylinders. Just curious if it's the same for gm. Our suburban is the wife's otherwise I'd uninstall the diablo tuner and do it. Maybe I will some day if I have time.

In my opinion the wind will make a bigger difference in gas mileage then 4 cylinder mode. If a guy wanted a 4 cylinder suv he probably should have bought one in the first place.
 

Marky Dissod

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Has anyone ever hooked up a scanner and watched the injector duty cycles while driving and when it Half@$$es?
I've seen screenshots from a ram where when the Half@$$ / V4 mode kicks in,
it doubles the injector duty cycle of the 4 active cylinders. Just curious if it's the same for gm?
Why would it not be?
Regardless how many CYLINDERS, or how big the ENGINE (note that 6.0L & 6.2L V8s with V4 mode tend to spend more time Half@$$ing)
it takes 'a certain amount' of horsepower to push a 6,000lb brick through the atmosphere @ 60MpH.
If working cylinders goes from 8 to 4, it stands to reason that those 4 cylinders must make the same power as 8 cylinders were producing a second ago,
which makes those 4 cylinders work 2x as hard and consume 2x as much fuel, or, the same amount of fuel as 8 cylinders were consuming a second ago.

The THEORY is that the throttle is more open in V4 mode to make the same power as it'd make in V8 mode.
Problem is that the lazy 4 cylinders go through more thermal cycles than the fulltime 4 cylinders.
The reality is that the lazy 4 cylinders wear / age at a different rate than the fulltime 4 cylinders,
which diminishes the MpG benefits as miles accumulate and the part-time V4 is changing shape compared to the fulltime V4.
 

15burban

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One instance I can think of is when 4 cylinder happens if a guy is almost completely off the throttle but not quite full coasting down a small decline the engine does not need to make the same amount of horsepower no matter what mode it's in as it would need to on a flat. So in that instance I wouldn't think it would need to double the duty cycle. Unless my thinking is wrong which it could be.

Edited to ask @Marky Dissod you say the benefit is maybe 2-3 mpg. If the injector duty cycle is doubled so same as if all 8 were injecting how does it save a guy 2-3 mpg? Or any gas? The same amount of fuel is being injected whether 4 injectors are going or all 8.
 

Marky Dissod

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One instance I can think of is when 4 cylinder happens if a guy is almost completely off the throttle but not quite full coasting down a small decline,
the engine does not need to make the same amount of horsepower no matter what mode it's in, as it would need to on a flat.
So in that instance I wouldn't think it would need to double the duty cycle. Unless my thinking is wrong which it could be.
When the driver requests 0.0% power from the engine,
AND the ecm determines that the road/tailwind is effectively providing enough power to drive the accessories, then still no,
the engine does not tend to go into V4 mode, because the four cylinders that usually keep all eight cylinders warm (though not to equal effect)
suddenly become the four cylinders that COOL DOWN all eight cylinders,
because the 4 lazy cylinders keep warm exhaust while the 4 working cylinders pass cool intake air through them without combusting anything.

At least that's what my tuner and I noticed during 0.0% TPS events; it'd only Half@$$ during 0.0% TPS if the coolant was warmer than usual (hot summer days).
The ecm tended to use V4 mode at very low load, but NOT ZERO load / DFCO - otherwise the ecm would idle in V4 mode, which'd be tres lame.
Edited to ask Marky Dissod you say the benefit is maybe 2-3MpG.
And don't forget that I also stated that this wanes as the engine ages - not that GM cares about that, CAFE MpG test scores occur when the engine / vehicle are brand new.
If the injector duty cycle is doubled, so same as if all 8 were injecting, how does it save a guy 2-3 mpg? Or any gas?
The same amount of fuel is being injected whether 4 injectors are going or all 8.
Let's say the momentary goal is to produce 30 horsepower to cruise down the highway.

In theory, a certain amount of power is 'wasted' by ANY engine trying to draw air through a partially closed throttle plate.
Just by opening the throttle plate, the engine becomes more efficient - not by leaps and bounds, but it is a consistently measurable effect.

A 2.65L V4 would need to open its throttle wider than a 5.3L V8 to produce that same '30' horsepower.
Because of 'closed loop', the ecm's INITIAL guess is to inject the same amount of fuel (ecm programmed to always guess 'slightly rich' for safety and emissions).
As the O2 sensors make their minor corrections over a few seconds, ecm will find that it consumes SLIGHTLY less fuel in V4 mode ...
especially when the engine is brand new.

As the engine ages, even assuming highest quality parts machining and assembly, the lazy V4 cools and warms and cools and warms over and over
while the fulltime V4 maintains much more temperature discipline - it keeps the lazy V4 warm, but not as consistently as it keeps itself warm.
This leads to two V4s wearing at different rates; not just one set of roller lifters wearing at a different rate, it's cam lobes cam bearings and even crank bearings.

As the one guy I know who had his tuner INCREASE V4 mode duty cycle, I can also attest to increased oil consumption, not just the waning of any MpG benefit.
 

15burban

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Then gm's half a$$ is different then Rams mds then since my ram will go into 4 cylinder mode anytime I'm cruising and completely off the gas pedal. As long as all the parameters are met for it of course (coolant temp, above a certain mph, etc). I had a range device installed the suburban the first week we had it and it's not my daily so I have no real feel for how the half a$$ mode works in it. I know a lot more about how it operates in my ram. Thanks for the info.
 

Marky Dissod

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gm's half@$$ is different then Rams half@$$ then, since my ram will go into V4 mode anytime I'm cruising and completely off the gas pedal.
As long as all the parameters are met for it of course (coolant temp, above a certain mph, etc).
I had a range device installed the suburban the first week we had it, and it's not my daily, so I have no real feel for how half@$$ works in it.
I know a lot more about how it operates in my ram.
3 things.
1stly, the earliest versions of Chrysler's Engine Half@$$ had too-long duty cycles; it would stay in V4 mode long enough to cleave engine blocks and cranks.
Chrysler had to reduce duty cycle lengths to keep the engine warm enough to avoid self-destruction.

2ndly, GM & Chrysler basically use the same types of criteria -
for a pretty thorough list, visit
and scroll down to GM > Engine > Fuel Control > COT, Lean Cruise ... Displacement On Demand -
but since GM was afraid of repeating Chrysler's mistakes, GM's Engine Half@$$ uses more boundary conditions to effect duty cycles shorter than Chrysler's.

3rdly, from my unique personal experience adding more Half@$$ duty cycles AND ALSO extending Half@$$ duty cycle lengths beyond GM's intents,
I know that even if you change the motor oil and filter every 2500 - 3000 miles with Group4 synthetic oil and suffer no valvetrain issues,
the part-time piston rings and crowns will eventually 'coke' - the lazy V4 cylinders will consume (more) oil (than the fulltime V4).

Since I'm not able to imagine the PCV modifications needed to counter this oil consumption,
it's another reason to simply disable Engine Half@$$ at the first possible opportunity.
 

RET423

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AFM was gimmick to trick the EPA into thinking they hit a CAFE standard that they never hit; so they could keep selling an awesome engine that their customers wanted without a huge penalty

It can't improve fuel econony, it can only make it worse; the illusion that fewer cylinders means less fuel used doing the same work plus a bit more (dragging four non contributing pistons takes energy) is just not possible

I am grateful the EPA fell for it so we got to keep the LS for many more years but I am even more grateful they chose a design that makes it easy to remove & replace with good components
 

Marky Dissod

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... grateful the EPA fell for it ...
The entire reason why they fell for it, is because when the entire vehicle is completely brand new, V4 mode does measurably reduce fuel consumption, by JUST ENOUGH for automakers to care, precisely because of CAFE MpG testing.
Don't know a single person who ever decided against buying a vehicle because of 2MpG.

By 50,000 miles, nevermind 100k or more, the part-time V4 has been breaking itself in / wearing itself out differently than the fulltime V4.
Net result: fuel consumption benefit of V4 mode fades over time.

If I hop around on one leg long enough ...
 

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