Tranny fluid change?

[jasper10101010]

Guys, I came over from thforum and wanted to get some guidance. I recently hit 100k and started doing some tune up maintenance. I have so far changed the plugs(ac delco, which I will be pulling to re-gap to .040, as I followed the owners manual and went 10 .060), plan on new wires as well. I changed out the pcv, oil/filter, air filter, diff oil, and replaced an o2 sensor due to a code.

I have a fuel filter, but need to buy the QD tool for the flex fuel line...pita!

Now, I'm looking at doing the tranny fluid and filter, it's been a long while since I've done this to any vehicle. Looking at the pan, it has a drain plug, which is nice, I remember being dowsed in tranny oil the last time I done this to a vehicle! This may seem like a stupid question, but is there a fill plug on these tranny's? I think I saw a small plug but am not sure if that's it! I don't want to drop the pan and not know how to get the new oil in! Also, I saw on Autozone that there is two different options for the filter type, one for a shallow pan, one for a deep pan...I have the flex fuel apparently(did not know this until I got the wrong belt and fuel filter!) I assume it has the deep pan, it looks deeper than a standard pan.

Help! I need to know if this is something I can easily replace the fluid in or if this is a complete pain! Let me know what you think!

Thanks,
Jason

[Big Tap]

I had my tranny fluid replaced during an oil change. I usually do these types of things myself, but the flush that they do is something I don't have the equipment for. They ended up doing a complete tranny flush for me, along with the filter replacement, and it did wonders for the shifting. It's just something to consider.
When I change the fluid on my '89 Chevy truck, I usually just add the fluid through the dipstick tube and it seems to work ok.

[tybardy]

yes i recomend spending $100 and having the full flush done by the shop, you do not have the ability to do a full flush yourself... and i would also request Dexron VI instead of Dexron III

[Drgnblood]

yes i recomend spending $100 and having the full flush done by the shop, you do not have the ability to do a full flush yourself... and i would also request Dexron VI instead of Dexron III


what do you think of the royal puple atf....do you recommend it....its 11.99 a qt on post...just curious if its any different than the others

[tybardy]

RP fluids are top fucking notch, there gear oil is unbeatable IMO.... however RP doesnt make a Dexron VI product, and IF you tranny requires Dexron product which is what is reconded and "required" for GM trannies... now, that being said RP will also tell you if your vehicle requires Dexron VI (i dont think our does but dont quote me on this) not to use RP ATF. however they do make a substitute for Dex III... I was going to have the shop order me some RP and use that as well untill the Tech called me and told me to contact RP about it because he "didnt recomend it"

i use RP motor oil and plan on using the gear oil when that day comes as well

[Drgnblood]

RP fluids are top fucking notch, there gear oil is unbeatable IMO.... however RP doesnt make a Dexron VI product, and IF you tranny requires Dexron product which is what is reconded and "required" for GM trannies... now, that being said RP will also tell you if your vehicle requires Dexron VI (i dont think our does but dont quote me on this) not to use RP ATF. however they do make a substitute for Dex III... I was going to have the shop order me some RP and use that as well untill the Tech called me and told me to contact RP about it because he "didnt recomend it"

alright i will contact them and find out.....i dont want to f anything up...i was thinking of doing the flush cuz im getting my vette servo soon....im at 86,351 mi so i figured the original owners prolly didnt do much to it....

---------- Post added at 12:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:07 PM ----------

Guys, I came over from thforum and wanted to get some guidance

Oh and Welcome to the Forum....Wealth of knowledge over here.....

[jasper10101010]

Thanks guys, I've read differing opinions on the tranny flush with a high mileage vehicle. I'm on the original owner and don't know how often the fluid was changed, if ever! I read a full flush can stir things up and really screw up the tranny. I read it's best to just change the filter and fluid. What are your thoughts on that? The shop down the street quoted $125 or so to just do the fluid and filter change, not sure if they even do a flush. I'll call shortly and see what they offer. What about the refilling of the fluid if I decide to do it myself. The dipstick hole the only option?!?!?

Thanks guys!

[tybardy]

to my best.... i think its the dipstick hole and youll lose about 5 quarts when you drop the pan and di it yourself. Also, $125 seems high, ESPECIALL if they arent doing a full flush. I have a reputable shop up the road quote me $108 and that with Dexron VI (which is a bit more $$ per quart)

I have also heard about doing this stuff to your tranny after high milage... but i wonder what is worse...

[Nappers]

I've read that backward flushing of tranny pushes debris backwards in places it shouldn't be which is not good.....With that....I drain the pan (I have the deep pan) every year and get about 5-6qts every drain and have done so since 2005 and have 138,000 miles on the clock.

[road1will]

I paid the 100 or so dollars at the dealer for a flush and filter change at around 60k miles and transmission definitely seems to shift smoother and feel tighter now...

[jasper10101010]

I believe I'll do it myself, seems easy enough. There has to be a better method to refilling the pan though...right?!?!?!? I will drain, drop pan and filter, replace filter, bolt back up and figure out how the hell to get the fluid back in!!! If it's down the dipstick, that's crazy...surely there's an upper plug to refill it...Thanks for all the input. I'm a little nervous about the flush deal though...don't want to have the trans rebuilt just because of a tune up!

[Nappers]

On my '00 it's filled through the dipstick tube.....

I'm leary on a flush.....That's just me, seen some good results and praise them and seen some bad results and felt bad that a new tranny was needed.....probably needed one anyways.

"Don't change the oil, it'll blow up" LOL

[Max]

I just keep trying to blow up my transmission, no luck thus far. Drain and fill is usually a better idea than a flush with higher mileage.

[withac]

I would run RP in every place it could go if I could afford it.

Here are some email exchanges between an RP rep and myself. His replies are in red.



A flush is forcing fluid in to push the old out.

A pan drop is just what it sounds like. Your drop the bottom part of your transmission and change the filter/ clean the screen. Then you put it the pan back on and fill up with the amount needed.

Drive a few thousand miles and repeat the pan drop to get more of our fluid into the transmission. Dealers usually do not recommend a flush as they do not have the equipment to do it.

Have a great day.

This is really helping, thank you. If I may continue. If I just do a pan drop then i'll be mixing the RP with what's left in the tranny and from the numbers you indicated, the RP will be diluted/mixed with what's still in there. Is that bad/do you see any benefits from that or does RP recommend a flush when switching to ensure the full benefits?
Thanks.


The pan drop is fine, our will over power what ever oil it mixes with as our film strength is 400 times stronger. With the mix we also recommend doing another pan drop at 5,000 miles to get a high concentrate of our oil in the tranny.

MY PERSONAL opinion-
A flush is like a empty glass with sugar in the bottom of it, then you pour tea into it. The sugar is stirred up and not is floating all around. What if the sugar was metal shavings in the pan and you flushed the transmission? Well the shavings will stir and go all over the transmission and could give you problems later. I know a lot of people who have never had a problem with flushes, but I myself would never have a flush done on my person car/truck. It is your call and this is my opinion not Royal Purple’s.


Have not seen that site before. One of the guys talks about Mobil 1 and how it is $5 and RP is $7. Here is an article that show the hp gain and torque gain over Mobil 1 from an independent 3rd party- http://www.royalpurple.com/corvette_enthusiast/corvette_enthusiast.html. Also Mobil 1 has to be changed every 4,000- 5,000 miles while our oil can go 12,000- 15,000 miles with a filter change and oil top off every 4,000- 5,000 miles.

Dodge with 5 quarts-

Mobil 1- 5 quarts x $5= $25+ tax and a filter
4,000 miles later $25+tax and a filter again
8,000 miles $25+tax and filter
12,000 miles $25+ tax and a filter

$100+ tax and 4 filters

Royal Purple- 5 quarts x $7= $35+ tax and a filter
4,000 miles 1 quarts to replace the quart lost by filter change $7+tax and filter
8,000 miles 1 quart $7+ tax and filter
12,000 5 quarts x $7=$35+ tax and filter

$84+ tax and 4 filters

That does not count the fuel savings since we are increasing the power on the car by reducing the parasitic loss. Here is a Dodge Ram that gained 24 lbs of torque by changing all of the fluid over to our oil on “TRUCKS”- http://www.royalpurple.com/video/video.html


Hope this helps

[dec322]

I have been thinking about changing the tranny fluid in my Yukon. It has 97k on it and the manual says to change the fluid/filter at 100k (if it was not used for towing). I talked to my local express oil and that guy told me that I should not touch it if the fluid has over 75k on it. It had something to do with the gears "glazing". He said they would do it but I would have to sign a waiver.

He also told me that you should never change the brake fluid...unless it get contaminated.

Sounds weird to me...what do you guys think?

[hapyspaz]

Been doing the preventative maintenance service game for about 12 years now; here's the skinny on flushes :imo:.

If your fliud is not broken down (thinned out and/or discolored) and you are at the recommended service interval, flushing the system is good for it. Don't be scared off by the fact that it has 100k on the fluid, the same fluid was recommmended every 30k until they started making transmissions that ran cooler than NASA rockets. Cooler running transmissions make for longer lasting fluids (hence why GM leads the field as one of only a few manufacturers that have a 100k interval)

If the fluid is broken down, then pan drop, replace filter, refill, run for 5k, rinse and repeat.

Theory behind this (and I've seen it happen). If your fluid is in good shape and you are at the rec. interval, it is good to perform the service, the interval is in place to keep your fluid from getting bad.

If you have gone past the rec. interval, or you fluid is in poor condition, flushing the system will shock the gearbox. Over time, your transmission adjust to the fluid as it slowly breaks down, similar to how most people dont realize their shocks are worn out because they have adjusted to them as they have worn out. If you flush out your thinned out fluid with completely new fluid, you are going to shock the transmission because it doesnt know how to perform with the good fluid, causing problems. Instead of changing all the fluid, do 1/3 of it, and let the transmission readjust itself as it gets used to the better fluid.

Another thing that I notice on the first post.

I have so far changed the plugs(ac delco, which I will be pulling to re-gap to .040, as I followed the owners manual and went 10 .060), plan on new wires as well.

Maybe Im thinking of a different year/engine, but I thought this engine took irridium spark plugs, which you do not want to regap. :Nonono:

[Nappers]

Another thing that I notice on the first post.



Maybe Im thinking of a different year/engine, but I thought this engine took irridium spark plugs, which you do not want to regap. :Nonono:

I thought the same......I have GM Iridiums and my parts guy said just throw 'em in and don't gap them and I think the box said not to gap.

[hapyspaz]

I thought the same......I have GM Iridiums and my parts guy said just throw 'em in and don't gap them and I think the box said not to gap.

The iridium center electrode is very thin. Unlike a conventional plug, you cannot gap the plug by sandwiching a gap tool between the electrode and the ground strap, then pushing on the ground strap. The hard electrode will dig into the gap tool, and when you remove the gap tool, you'll break the electrode. Instead, adjust the ground strap by tapping it on a hard surface, or by pulling it gently with a tool; then measure the gap using your gap tool.

[dub02gpgt]

i wasn't aware of the specifics on this, but i switched all of my fluids except for the transfer case to RP. i also run RP in my grand prix and my dad runs it in all of his vehicles. i've never noticed any issues with having RP in my transmission either...

[jasper10101010]

I thought I was losing my mind regarding the plug gapping...I knew I read that they should be gapped to meet engine spec...so I had to go look at the plug box. So, I bought the damn ac delco iridium plugs...was a it scared to gap them, but it specifically reads on the box to gap them to meet engine specs! So, I have one of those round plug gappers and that;s what I used to get them to .060, it did scratch up my gapper, but did not appear to cause any damage at all to the super hard iridium tips! I will be pulling the plugs and gapping them back to .040 this coming up weekend.

I just thought I would let you guys in on the plug gap instructions on the ac delco box! I can post a pic of the box for reference if you'd like! I thought I was losing my mind...

[withac]

You don't need to pry on the center electrode to open a gap. Slide the side electrode through the hole and pry down/away from the plug. The pressure is on the outer edge of the side electrode not the center electrode, although before I figured out I didn't need to regap the TR55's I tried and the side electrode was so stiff I couldn't move it, but I've been able to open the gap on standard plugs that way.

[05TahoeZ71]

Sorry to drag this back out. I'm new so let me know if I'm F'd up. Jason hopefully you haven't done your tranny drain and fill, cause I'll let you in on a couple of gotchas. Take a look at your tranny pan, if it is multi leveled, i.e. it has a deeper portion and a shallo portion to it, it's the deep pan if it's uniformly level across the bottom, it's the shallow pan. This only makes a big difference if you have the deep pan and get the shallow filter, it won't be sitting down in the fluid.

The drain and fill is really easy especially since you have a drain plug, mine didn't. After you drain it, pull of the tranny pan. This will be particularly difficult with the shift cable bracket on the driver's side. It takes a T-40, but mine was impossible to get at even with a stubby wrench, so I just bent it out of the way. With the pan off, clean it and the magnet, I use carb cleaner.

Now this is the biggest gotcha I wish I woulda known. You just pull the filter out of the valve body. There is a rubber and metal gasket up in the filter port on the valve body. If you can't pull it out with your finger, leave it in and just slap the new filter in. I almost ended up f-ing up my valve body trying to get that thing out. Slap your pan back on with a new gasket, bend the shift cable bracket back in place, and fill her up from the tranny tube under the hood. For your '06, Dexron VI is recommended and will take somewhere around 4.5 to 5 quarts.

As far as the flush goes, I would echo what everyone else has said. Also my buddies at the local GM dealership straight up told me the chemicals they flush with are really funky and tend to F up engines more than help them, so stay away. If you're looking to swap out RP, do a drain and fill, you'll only replace about 1/3 of the fluid, drive for 5k miles and do another one, then another. I would stay away from the technique of draining, filling, and turning your engine on and shifting to flush it. Yikes. Hope that helps.

[jasper10101010]

Man, I have been putting this off, but intend to change it this weekend. I really appreciate the insight you have given here. I'll have to get back under and check the trans pan. I believe, if memory serves, that the pan is uniform across the bottom, with only an indentation around the drain plug. It sounds simple enough once I figure out exactly which pan I have.

On a side note, I have an '03, not an '06, and it's not a Denali. Is the Dexron 6 still good to use? I assume so, as it should be an improvement over the old type, correct? Again, thanks for you input man, it should make things a bit easier!

Now, I just have to pull those plugs back out and re-gap them back to .040!

[BOSS]

Sorry to drag this back out. I'm new so let me know if I'm F'd up. Jason hopefully you haven't done your tranny drain and fill, cause I'll let you in on a couple of gotchas. Take a look at your tranny pan, if it is multi leveled, i.e. it has a deeper portion and a shallo portion to it, it's the deep pan if it's uniformly level across the bottom, it's the shallow pan. This only makes a big difference if you have the deep pan and get the shallow filter, it won't be sitting down in the fluid.

The drain and fill is really easy especially since you have a drain plug, mine didn't. After you drain it, pull of the tranny pan. This will be particularly difficult with the shift cable bracket on the driver's side. It takes a T-40, but mine was impossible to get at even with a stubby wrench, so I just bent it out of the way. With the pan off, clean it and the magnet, I use carb cleaner.

Now this is the biggest gotcha I wish I woulda known. You just pull the filter out of the valve body. There is a rubber and metal gasket up in the filter port on the valve body. If you can't pull it out with your finger, leave it in and just slap the new filter in. I almost ended up f-ing up my valve body trying to get that thing out. Slap your pan back on with a new gasket, bend the shift cable bracket back in place, and fill her up from the tranny tube under the hood. For your '06, Dexron VI is recommended and will take somewhere around 4.5 to 5 quarts.

As far as the flush goes, I would echo what everyone else has said. Also my buddies at the local GM dealership straight up told me the chemicals they flush with are really funky and tend to F up engines more than help them, so stay away. If you're looking to swap out RP, do a drain and fill, you'll only replace about 1/3 of the fluid, drive for 5k miles and do another one, then another. I would stay away from the technique of draining, filling, and turning your engine on and shifting to flush it. Yikes. Hope that helps.

Great post, thanks!

BOSS

[Dahlar]

I am also curious of this subject as my 02 yukon just hit 190 and I don't think the fluid has been changed since 75K or so. It sounds like I should just do a drain and filter and put in 5 quarts if Dexron VI?

[05TahoeZ71]

As far as I know 06 was the first year Dexron VI was recommended. I could be wrong though. I put it in my 05 at 65k miles (I've been towing quite a bit). Can't see how it can be any worse. So far the shifts have been a little stiffer, but I've also been playing around with the shift pressures on my programmer when I'm not towing. I initially put in 4 quarts and kept doing hot tranny fluid checks for a week and it took just under 5 quarts.

Jason, how many miles are on your 03? If you have over a hundred k and haven't changed the tranny fluid I would drain, swap the filter, and fill it up. If not you could just get away with a drain and fill, much easier and quicker. GM only recommends a drain and fill at 100k (as long as you aren't towing) and some of them don't even put a new filter in.

Let me know if you want more details.

[jasper10101010]

I'm at 100k, a little over. I bought it with around 80k, not had any issues with it, just want to keep it that way! I think I will go at it this weekend and see how it turns out. I still can't get past the refill method through the damn dipstick tube! That seems so inefficient, can't imagine not having a refill plug somewhere! Oh well, no big deal. I'll let you guys know how it turns out this weekend.

[OmarR]

To further add, you guys can do a flush yourself in your own garage. All you need is some clear line tubing and a large bucket from Home Depot. Flush it out through the lower line at the radiator, one/two quarts at a time.

I bought my Tahoe with 41K, I did my own flush at 50K and switched over to synthetic. Will probably do it again at 90K. Still running strong!

[05TahoeZ71]

Did you turn it on and run it through the gears while somebody else poured tranny fluid in? I read about something similar in another forum or a click and clack type website. I was a little wary of trying it out. Do you tow a lot to flush that often or just being safe? I'm just curious.

[withac]

The problems with some flushes is that they can stir up stuff that can lead to problems. I read of a way to do it so that's not an issue but I can't find where I saved it. If I recall, you take the hoses off your tranny cooler, you put the one that feeds back into the tranny in your bucket or bottles of new fluid. You put the hose feeding into the cooler into your collection bucket. You let it suck in clean fluid and the clean fluid supposedly pushed the old dirty stuff out ahead of it. You keep letting it suck in new fluid until the stuf running into your bucket runs clean. Then you know you have new, clean fluid all the way through your tranny. The article said this was better than a traditional flush because it didn't stir things up, the fluid just flowed through the tranny in the same path and direction that it always did. You may not get any sediment or whatever cleaned out this way, but you should get a complete fluid change without worrying about stirring stuff up.

FWIW.

[OmarR]

Did you turn it on and run it through the gears while somebody else poured tranny fluid in? Do you tow a lot to flush that often or just being safe?

You do not have to run it through the gears. The tranny pump is going, even in park. I do not tow at all, I am just being safe.

Withac, the method you describe is pretty much what the home flush entails. You are just routing out old fluid, and routing in new fluid. But the way most do it is:

1. Turn on the truck for about 20 seconds to dump out about 1-2 quarts in big bucket, then turn truck off
2. Pour in 1-2 new quarts through dipstick with funnel.
3. Repeat

You just do those steps until you have cycled through the entire capacity of the truck. The only (probable) issue is when your big bucket starts getting full and you get worried about whether you poured too much in versus siphoned too much out, or vice-versa. So what you can do is take the empty quart bottles and start filling them from the bucket. Label those "USED" and you can easily see where you stand. It also makes it easier for recycling purposes.

Or...the way I did it...I put my bucket on my digital scale and just did it by weight. I forgot how much each quart weighs, but I can look it up. I wrote it down somewhere.

Either way, if you take your time, will work out with no problems.

[BOSS]

I am also curious of this subject as my 02 yukon just hit 190 and I don't think the fluid has been changed since 75K or so. It sounds like I should just do a drain and filter and put in 5 quarts if Dexron VI?

x2...anybody?

[YNOT]

for me every 30,000 i do front and rear diffs, transfer case, transmission fluid/filter, fuel filter. just drain and fill yourself in the garage every 30,000 and drive the thing.

i just did it all this weekend, tons of fun laying on the garage floor.....lol. i don't trust most people to work on my stuff.

---------- Post added at 02:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:28 PM ----------

As far as I know 06 was the first year Dexron VI was recommended. I could be wrong though.
yeah on the bottom it says it's compatible with the older Dexron II and III call outs, i just put it in my 2001.

---------- Post added at 02:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:31 PM ----------

Sorry to drag this back out. I'm new so let me know if I'm F'd up. Jason hopefully you haven't done your tranny drain and fill, cause I'll let you in on a couple of gotchas. Take a look at your tranny pan, if it is multi leveled, i.e. it has a deeper portion and a shallo portion to it, it's the deep pan if it's uniformly level across the bottom, it's the shallow pan. This only makes a big difference if you have the deep pan and get the shallow filter, it won't be sitting down in the fluid.

The drain and fill is really easy especially since you have a drain plug, mine didn't. After you drain it, pull of the tranny pan. This will be particularly difficult with the shift cable bracket on the driver's side. It takes a T-40, but mine was impossible to get at even with a stubby wrench, so I just bent it out of the way. With the pan off, clean it and the magnet, I use carb cleaner.

Now this is the biggest gotcha I wish I woulda known. You just pull the filter out of the valve body. There is a rubber and metal gasket up in the filter port on the valve body. If you can't pull it out with your finger, leave it in and just slap the new filter in. I almost ended up f-ing up my valve body trying to get that thing out. Slap your pan back on with a new gasket, bend the shift cable bracket back in place, and fill her up from the tranny tube under the hood. For your '06, Dexron VI is recommended and will take somewhere around 4.5 to 5 quarts.

As far as the flush goes, I would echo what everyone else has said. Also my buddies at the local GM dealership straight up told me the chemicals they flush with are really funky and tend to F up engines more than help them, so stay away. If you're looking to swap out RP, do a drain and fill, you'll only replace about 1/3 of the fluid, drive for 5k miles and do another one, then another. I would stay away from the technique of draining, filling, and turning your engine on and shifting to flush it. Yikes. Hope that helps.
i've never heard of anyone getting those drain bolts out, gm screwed up on those. if you do get it out, i guess they make a steel replacement.
yeah i bent that shifter cable bracket out of the way because i couldn't get those t40's out.
i left the old trans filter seal in because the new filter fit nice and tight in there. (both on my tahoe and silverado)
i have the deep pan so i had to add 5 1/8 quarts.

[WickedGoat]

My shop uses a machine to do trans fluid exchanges. It is not a flush, but an exchange. We stick the tube down the trans dipstick and it sucks everything out of the pan. Then it adds back in about 5 quarts. The machine then tells you to start the car and row thru the gears about 5 times or so. Then we just leave it in neutral with the engine running and the machine just keeps sucking out the old and replacing it with new stuff. You can see the color of the old fluid coming out and new red fluid going in. The machine does a good job, and supposedly doing it this way, you never have to change the filter which obviously eliminates dropping the pan. We charge $100 for it and we use Dex6 because it is compatible with almost everything out there. This is probably the best way to go because it is not messy at all and can be done in less than 45 mins. Also, as far as when to change it..... We don't change it if the vehicle has 100K or more, unless it has been done at least once before or if manufacturer scheduled maintenance says to do so at 100K. The reason why is because over time, the bands and clutches break down and the contaminates flow with the trans fluid and stick to other parts of the trans. When you pull out the old fluid and put in the new fluid, it will cause the gritty pieces to come loose and flow with new fluid..... this is what kills the transmission and why most shops will say, "Just leave it alone and only top it off if it gets low". They don't want to be on the hook for a new trans for a measly $100 maintenance job. One last thing..... My neighbor just had her Hyundai trans fluid exchanged at 125K miles ...... Trans took a dump a week later..... I told her why and she was beside herself after that.